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Post by takewithfood on Jun 13, 2009 18:45:45 GMT -5
Hey gang,
So, I've decided that I don't like Energy Absorption/Reflection (likewise for Kinetic), and I'd like to totally rewrite them. I have some ideas in mind for a very complete system, but I'd like to attempt a much simpler version instead:
Basically, Energy Absorption would be an option for the Energy Defense modifier. For like +2 or +3 CL, stones of attack blocked by your Energy Defense just go right into your Energy Pool. If your Pool is full, then it just functions like regular Energy Defense. That's it.
For Kinetic Absorption, take the same Option and apply it to Toughness. Done.
For an additional +1 CL you can redirect absorbed energy into one chosen Action (pick when you buy the option), but you have to spend that energy right away on the next panel.
You can apply a discount (maybe -2CL?) to a redirected Action if you can ONLY power it this way.
Energy Defense should come with a decent discount that allows you to absorb only one element; or for a lesser discount, a bunch of related elements (such as heat related stuff: plasma, fire, lava, etc).
Maybe this can apply to Mental and Magical defense too.
Here's how I'd deal with some common Absorbers:
Lucas Bishop: He has Energy Defense out the wazoo with +2 CL for Energy Absorption, and for +1 CL he can redirect into a Force Blast. This Force Blast can only be powered via his Energy Defense. (In some depictions he can also beef himself up physically, which would be another redirect into a small Metamorphosis.)
Sebastian Shaw: He has Toughness with +2 (or 3?) CL for Kinetic Absorption and for an additional +1 CL he can redirect into Metamorphosis to beef up his physical abilities. He bought Metamorphosis with a -2 CL disadvantage because he can only power it through his Kinetic Absorption.
Strong Guy: He's pretty much like Sebastian Shaw.
Surge: She has Energy Defense with the Absorption Option, limited only to electricity, and for +1 CL she can redirect into a Force Blast. However, she can also power her Force Blast with her own energy. She also absorbs ambient energy (I'd like to make this a separate modifier or an Option when buying Energy Recovery). Her Speed is simply really high.
This is REALLY simple, but unless I'm psycho, it works.
(For those wondering about Absorb Ambient Energy, I'm considering calling it a +2 to +3 CL option for the Energy Recovery stat. You would recover a variable amount of energy depending on your proximity to your energy source. We'd have to write up a bunch of common energy sources; players can write new ones as needed, using the basic ones as guidelines.)
~TWF
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Post by WildKnight on Jun 13, 2009 19:03:00 GMT -5
The only problem with that as I see it is that Energy Absorption in the comics is clearly meant to be a way for people to gather extra energy beyond their normal reserves.
Both Shaw and Bishop have been shown to "boost" themselves with these powers.
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Post by takewithfood on Jun 13, 2009 19:15:00 GMT -5
Well, as long as we balance the price to account for it, the "Absorption" Option can just turn those Modifiers into Action Boxes which could store energy up to their ANs. But honestly, it's easier to just buy a higher Reserve. There is only so much that we can easily represent.
And what do you mean by "boost"? In the examples I gave, Shaw and Bishop both have Metamorphosis powered by their absorptions.. is that what you mean?
Example: Sebastian Shaw has Toughness 5 and has been taunting Colossus into fighting him. When the X-Man finally armors up, Shaw puts 4 stones of Close Combat into defense and waits for the beating.
Colossus punches him for 8 stones; not only is this not enough to hurt Shaw, but 5 of those stones are actually absorbed. Shaw redirects them into Metamorphosis (he paid an extra +1 CL to be able to do this). At the start of the next Page, he uses those 5 stones of Metamorphosis to boost his Strength by 4 and Toughness by 1. Another round of playing turtle and he should be more than a match for Colossus.
Note: Just occurred to me that we should put a cap on how much you can absorb per page. Probably equal to your MN. For an extra +1 CL maybe you can absorb twice that much.
~TWF
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Post by WildKnight on Jun 13, 2009 19:57:07 GMT -5
No, I mean that they always seemed to have more energy when "charged" than they did normally. Shaw in particular.
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Post by takewithfood on Jun 13, 2009 20:09:44 GMT -5
Ah, I see what you mean. Well, they can increase their Energy Pool via Metamorphosis, then fill it up by absorbing more punishment.
~TWF
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Post by WildKnight on Jun 13, 2009 20:17:27 GMT -5
Seems a lot more complex than just being able to have energy in excess of your normal pool that bleeds off at 1/panel and (in Shaw's case), being able to spend stones to increase your Abilities.
I mean, Metamorphosis is an awfully expensive "extra" Action to have to buy for a guy like Shaw, who can't make Force Blasts or grow wings... all he can do is get stronger...
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Post by takewithfood on Jun 13, 2009 20:26:53 GMT -5
It isn't as easy as "spend stones to increase abilities". Limits have to be set and costs balanced.
Also, having a separate Metamorphosis Action is a lot cheaper than adding even more Options to Toughness. Also, basic Metamorphosis only allows you to up your Physical abilities and basic Modifiers such as Toughness - you need to buy specific Options to grow wings, and I haven't offered ANY options that allow Force Blasts.
And I offered a discount for only being able to power it up via kinetic absorption. He's looking at around AN+0.
Exceeding your Pool is a good suggestion, but how far should it go? There should always be a max or he could sit around before a fight and build up a pool of 50,000+ stones of energy, which would be downright nutty. Maybe a max equal to twice your MN, and that bleeds off at 1/panel?
~TWF
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Post by WildKnight on Jun 13, 2009 20:37:53 GMT -5
Thats why I don't like the notion of adding it to Toughness as an option. It overcomplicates things.
As-is, both of those Actions are okay. The problem with Kinetic Absorption is that there is no set limit/panel to how much you can absorb, which obviously makes the character invulnerable to physical damage for a pretty cheap price.
If, like Energy A/R, you were limited to absorbing twice your AN in a panel, it'd be fine (I also think you should have to pay 3 energy to increase whatever ability you improve, rather than a straight 1 for 1)
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Post by takewithfood on Jun 13, 2009 20:49:28 GMT -5
Argh. I find it baffling that you think Energy A/R as written is less complicated than a rule I took about 5 sentences to describe. lol
I'm going to have to completely re-write Energy A/R, aren't I? That is going to take like 5 hours. The text is a friggin' insult to human communication. lol Arrrrrrgh.
I have to account for:
- characters who want to improve their abilities with Energy Absorption; - characters who want to fire kinetic energy as a force blast - characters who want to power some different action with their absorption
Also, let's say someone has Energy AR 5, Toughness 2, Reflexive Dodge 2. If they're hit with 5 stones of energy, when do the Toughness and RD take effect? Before or after absorption? In other words, does the character absorb 1 stone or 5? If defensive stones count first, characters will absorb very little energy during fights; if defensive stones count last, characters will quickly get overwhelmed.
EDIT: Another beef: Energy A/R costs so friggin' much, you're bound to have a craptastic AN. That makes returning fire with the same AN a total waste of time.
I friggin' hate this stupid, stupid power. I want to punch Bishop in the face so much. lol
~TWF (who isn't actually angry in the least, it's just fun to write this way ^___^ )
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Post by takewithfood on Jun 13, 2009 20:51:00 GMT -5
Additional note: The nail in the coffin for my "as option for Energy Defense" idea is this: What if someone wants tons of Toughness but only a little Kinetic Energy absorption? Argh argh argh I hate the world. lol
~TWF
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Post by WildKnight on Jun 13, 2009 21:00:14 GMT -5
To answer a few of your thoughts... I believe that anything that blocks/deflects/ignores is considered before anything that absorbs. Its not entirely logical, but it is logical more often than not, and having a simple rule that always works the same way is the best bet.
Second; I would write it to allow you to absorb one sort of attack (Kinetic, Mental, Energy, or Magic) that goes straight to the Energy Battery. Then create an Option that lets it go straight to a single Ability instead (I would suggest a 3/1 tradeoff).
Other things (like being redirected to a Force Blast or other Action (Metamorphosis, whatever) can be handled through an application of "Only through other Action/Modifier" for the accompanying action.
Ergo... Bishop has Energy Absorb at 6. He can absorb up to 12 stones from energy attacks/panel. His stones must go straight to his Energy Pool, since he doesn't have the Ability Enhancing Option.
Bishop also has Force Blast, with "Only through etc.", and can only use his Force Blast when his Energy Pool is currently greater than Maximum (i.e. he is "charged up")
Shinobi Shaw has Kinetic Absorption 6, and therefore can absorb 12 stones of physical attacks/panel. He also has the "redirect to Strength" and "redirect to Health" options. So he can send stones of "impact" that he absorbs to enhance either his Strength or his Dur.
A good practical limit to the increase of any one Ability is probably the AN in Absorption.
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Post by takewithfood on Jun 13, 2009 21:20:58 GMT -5
Well, this is what I was working on before the "option for energy defense" idea hit me. It isn't complete or fully adjusted yet (I haven't even tried to balance it; Kinetic Absorption is obviously not balanced):
[/b][/size] Energy Absorption is an Action that allows you to defensively absorb energy-based attacks. Not only does this protect you from suffering damage, it actually lends you power. Depending on which options you select, you may also be able to redirect this energy into another Action such as a Force Blast, or use it to heal yourself or improve your physical Abilities.
When you are targeted by an energy attack (such as a Force Blast), stones of attack go directly into your Energy Absorption Action Box. Your Action Box can store up to twice your AN in stones of energy; if or when your Action Box is full, any remaining stones of attack are compared to your stones of defense as usual.
Energy that you've absorbed in this fashion slowly fades away. At the end of each panel, remove 1 stone of energy from your Action Box.
Options +1 CL = Redirect Into Action. Choose one Action; if your Energy Absorption Action Box fills up you can absorb even more energy by filling up the chosen Action. Only when both Action Boxes are filled do you suffer any damage from excess stones of attack. On the following Page, any stones transfered to the chosen Action Box must be used for effect (not shifted to defense).
+1 CL = Enhance Ability. Choose one of the following Abilities: Intelligence, Strength, Speed, Agility; for each stone in your Action Box you may treat your Ability as though it were one point higher. The most that you can increase your Ability in this fashion is equal to your AN.
+1 CL = Energy Buffer. Even when your Action Box is filled up, stones of attack in excess of your defense come out of your Energy Pool rather than dealing damage.
-2 CL or -3 CL = Limited Scope. You can only absorb one type of energy. Narrow categories such as sonic or electricity are worth a discount of three Cost Levels; broad categories such as "heat" (which might include plasma, fire, and similar sources) may only worth a discount of two Cost Levels.
+0 CL = Absorb Kinetic Energy. Instead of absorbing raw energy, you absorb the kinetic energy of impacts, such as punches, falling debris and the like. You can only absorb and store a maximum number of stones equal to your Action Number, not twice your Action Number.[/quote]
Back to this drawing board, I guess.
~TWF
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Post by Neros on Jun 14, 2009 16:05:29 GMT -5
I want to reply to the post in the "One in a million" to, but im rather tired right now (and sunburned by the way) so heres just a quicj one:
Sounds like a great way of doing it.. Im all for giving it a go around.. But, if you payed +4 costlevels, you could enhance all you Abilities by absorbing attacks? To me, it sounds cheap.. Or can't you choose the option more than once? A option which where in the House Rule guide which i really liked was the "absorb ambient energy".. It one of those things which could really fit great with a master of the sun or electricity.. Or maybe even for any master at all..
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Post by takewithfood on Jun 14, 2009 16:11:58 GMT -5
I'm probably going to go with something much more similar to the original rule. If it really doesn't work out, I'll come back to the "option for Energy Defense" idea. (Sorry, misread your post at first. It's really sunny and I can't see the monitor very well!)
Yeah, in theory for +4 CL you could increase all those abilities; but perhaps I should phrase it so that you can't count each stone more than once. It's tricky to phrase.
And yeah, I liked the idea of Absorb Ambient Energy, too; I want to incorporate it, but balance-wise I think it's best suited as an option for the Energy Recovery ability.
~TWF
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Post by takewithfood on Jun 14, 2009 16:33:11 GMT -5
Okay, been working on it. Now it looks like this:
[/b][/size] Energy Absorption is an Action that allows you to defensively absorb energy-based attacks. Not only does this protect you from suffering damage, it actually lends you power. Depending on which options you select, you may also be able to redirect this energy into another Action such as a Force Blast, or use it to heal yourself or improve your physical Abilities.
When you are targeted by an energy attack (such as a Force Blast), stones of attack go directly into your Energy Absorption Action Box. Your Action Box can store up to twice your AN in stones of energy; if or when your Action Box is full, any remaining stones of attack are compared to your stones of defense as usual.
Energy that you've absorbed in this fashion slowly fades away. At the end of each panel, remove 1 stone of energy from your Action Box.
Options +1 CL = Redirect Into Action. Choose one Action; at the start of a Page you can opt to transfer any number of stones from your Action Box into the chosen Action. Stones transfered to the chosen Action Box must be used immediately. If the chosen action can only be powered this way, you may purchase it at a -2 Cost Level discount "Only by Energy Absorption".
+2 CL = Redirect Into Pool. At the start of a Page you can opt to transfer any number of stones from your Action Box into your Energy Pool, up to your Energy Pool's normal limit.
+1 CL = Enhance Ability. Choose one of the following Abilities: Intelligence, Strength, Speed, Agility, Durability; you can improve your chosen ability by allocating stones in your Action Box on a one-for-one basis. Allocated stones remain in your Action Box until they bleed away. The most that you can increase your Ability in this fashion is equal to your AN.
+1 CL = Energy Buffer. Even when your Action Box is filled up, stones of attack from energy sources in excess of your defense come out of your Energy Pool rather than dealing damage.
+2 CL = Regeneration. You can heal your own wounds (but not someone else's) by spending energy from your Energy Absorption Action Box. For every 3 stones spent you heal 1 white stone of health. You can heal a maximum number of white stones of health equal to your AN per day.
-2 CL or -3 CL = Limited Scope. You can only absorb one type of energy. Narrow categories such as sonic or electricity are worth a discount of three Cost Levels; broad categories such as "heat" (which might include plasma, fire, and similar sources) may only worth a discount of two Cost Levels.[/quote]
I still really don't like it. It's almost impossible to adjust prices for something like this.
~TWF
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