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Post by Ushima911 on Dec 18, 2017 15:04:18 GMT -5
With y’all on this too out of curiosity what were some of your points? Spoilers to movies ahead. Thus, Spoiler tags:
Leia using the force to not die in space and literally fly to the ship. Dumb. To me anyways. I get that we don't know that she wasn't training with the force in all of the time skip. But even so, I couldn't see someone like Luke, or even Obi Wan doing that.
Hologram Luke at the end. Cool. Really cool, but should have just went like Obi Wan did. Get slashed through, and the clothes fall to the floor as he ascends.
Those are two of the major ones for me, and a lot of people apparently. But overall, more character development in this one, which I love since character development is sort of a strict thing for me. ..even if Kylo did wind up reverting back to how he started.
Also, didn't like the new little penguin creatures that Disney's trying to market for. ..personally.
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Post by Savant on Dec 18, 2017 18:24:18 GMT -5
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Post by takewithfood on Dec 19, 2017 18:15:31 GMT -5
Just saw it a little while ago. Here's my take: So, I didn't like it, but I didn't hate it. I really like some of the things they did, or tried to do, and in general I admire that they tried to take Star Wars in a new direction. This is what I wanted them to do after they basically remade A New Hope and called it The Force Awakens. I liked Awakens, and I think it was a good idea, and maybe even necessary after the disastrous prequels to give audiences that good old fashioned Star Wars feel (even if maybe they went too far). But now that that work is out of the way, The Last Jedi is their chance to do something new, and they took it.
And I think they screwed up pretty badly, but oh well. At least they tried.
It's like if Santa brought you 5 Christmas presents, and while one of them was the new smart phone you really needed and wanted, the other 4 were maybe an old newspaper, one used sock, an empty can of beans, and a dried up Bic pen with no cap. So, like, yay, new phone, can't complain.. but also WTF, Santa?
I'll start with the good stuff:
1. I liked most of Rei's scenes and storyline, especially her conversations with Luke and Kylo Ben. (I don't know whether to call him Kylo Ren or Ben at this point.)
2. Specifically, I dig a lot of Luke's philosophy on the Force, especially the part about the Jedi not owning the Force. With or without the Jedi, the Force will always be everywhere. It's nice to hear some philosophy, which is in contrast to the way the prequels treated the Force as an excuse to do cool special effects shit.
3. Yoda was clearly a puppet, as he should be.
Okay so I thought I'd be able to come up with more than 2 things, but while they're not numerous, they are central to the movie. Well, sort of. Anyway, on to the bad...
1. Aside from the Kylo/Rei plotline, nothing in this movie makes any fucking sense. I never understood why the First Order got stuck puttering behind the fleeing Rebels in the slowest, most boring vehicle chase in the history of cinema. Why the hell can they not just send a few ships ahead at light speed, or call in some other ships from elsewhere, or do literally anything except slowly chase them at impulse speed for several hours? This is the premise of almost the entire movie, and it makes NO sense.
2. In general the movie does not advance anyone's story except Ben's and maybe Rei's. Snoke dies, and Rei kind of learns some stuff about the Force, but otherwise everyone is in the same spot. Finn is sort of hanging around the Resistance and still has unrequited feelings for Rei. Poe is a pilot and.. that's about it. Leia is still leading the Resistance and they're feeling from the First Order, only on a slightly different planet. The First Order has had a leadership change from one Sith to another and is still chasing the Resistance and I guess being evil in general. Luke is dead, but he wasn't really a part of the story before now anyway, and he's just going to do Force Ghost stuff if he wants to.
3. For a character who gets zero viewpoint scenes, Rose gets a ton of screen time. Look back at how Rei, Finn, and Poe were shot and introduced in Awakens; we got to see them alone, see what they're thinking, what they want. Rose is in as much of this movie as Finn, yet she is always shot as a tertiary character. When she risks her life to ram Finn's ship out of his suicide run, the decision comes out of nowhere because we have almost no idea what makes her tick. She's in love with Finn now? After knowing him for, what, a few hours?
4. The movie went on about an hour too long, and could have ended at several points. Like, wow, Snoke is dead, and Rei and Kylo had their dramatic fight scene but have now parted ways. Feels like the end is coming up.. wait.. no.. Oh, Poe was wrong about his plan, the Purple Hair Lady had a plan to escape all along! Wait.. no.. now she is sacrificing herself so the Resistance fleet can escape, what a noble way to end the movie.. wait.. no, they're on the planet now, but surely they're safe wait no there's a giant cannon and they're going to blow it up wait no they didn't blow it up now Luke is here FUCKING END THE MOVIE WHAT ARE YOU DOING lol
5. Basically everything that happened on the casino planet was garbage. They took at least three unnecessary pot shots at Capitalism that had me rolling my eyes, and I'm a big ol' Marxist commie. Then Finn, who is supposed to be on a heart-pumping mission to not only save Rei, but maybe the entire Resistance, gets easily distracted by the opulence. Then there's a weird animal riding chase scene that felt like something out of a Harry Potter film, or maybe even the prequels. Then they make off with Benicio Del Toro playing a character called Benicio Del Toro, and then this shady character that we don't even know betrays them (wow... what a surprise) and it turns out none of this matters anyway because the enemy ship just blows up and they miraculously escape for no reason. Did no one else read the script before they filmed it?
6. EDIT: I'm going to add one more thing quickly, which might be the biggest problem with the film in the big picture: It takes away several elements of the story, while adding almost nothing. Snoke dies, Luke dies, and aside from Rose (who I don't care about at all), no new characters or plotlines are really introduced. Rei is left without training or guidance, and her parents are unimportant to the story; Ben is sort of in charge of the First Order, but I don't really see him doing anything that differently than Snoke. The whole saga feels a lot smaller, now, with almost nowhere left to go.
I could go on, but you get the point. It's a huge, overly ambitious mess, and I would love to have seen them edit it down by at least an hour, and reshoot any kind of scene that made the chase plotline make any kind of sense. I have no idea where they intend to go from here for the sequel, but they need to do some damage control. They can still right the ship, but I'd say its sinking.
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Post by takewithfood on Jan 15, 2018 14:32:58 GMT -5
I'm actually shocked that this is all we've had to say about this movie. lol
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Post by Ushima911 on Jan 15, 2018 17:44:43 GMT -5
I'm actually shocked that this is all we've had to say about this movie. lol I mean, I CAN go off some more..
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Post by Gris on Jan 16, 2018 10:30:54 GMT -5
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Post by takewithfood on Jan 16, 2018 22:42:39 GMT -5
I should maybe add that I'm pleasantly surprised that we aren't arguing about it for 12 pages. ^___^
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Post by Ushima911 on Jan 17, 2018 0:07:30 GMT -5
The ANGRY people who used to live on these boards aren't here anymore. So, we have become a civilized community. One where we do not grunt and point at things, but rather, share our opinions like sophisticated ladies and gentlemen. As proof, I tip my top hat to you, Mr food. However, should you wish to argue, I shall 'get down,' as the kids say and squabble in fisticuffs.
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Post by takewithfood on Jan 17, 2018 16:19:13 GMT -5
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Post by roxolid on Mar 9, 2018 3:45:35 GMT -5
Not wanting to necro or anything, but when this thing comes out on bluray I'll give it another go. The memories I have from the cinema viewing aren't good though. I agree with all the criticisms levelled at it and struggle to take anything positive. It's almost like they ran out of interesting things to do and padded the film out with the chase and the casino stuff. I get that the original cast wanted a last payday (and Harrison Ford wanted out after ESB or so it seems) and that the film is a passing of the torch, so to speak but... It's not a good film. Rogue One was excellent. Force Awakens was pretty good. This is down there with the prequels, and I don't care enough about those to even think about them. Ok, that's a bit harsh. It's better than the prequels. That's about the best I can come up with.
We'll see what happens when I watch it again.
Probably more eye rolling.
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Post by Gris on May 26, 2018 4:39:54 GMT -5
Watched it last night and it turns out that Solo isn't a bad movie despite the production mayhem it went through. Sure it can be bland or risk averse at times, but that it works to such a degree to be a decent to good movie is quite the pleasant surprise. Even me, quite allergic to those small winks and nudges (hey! I recognize that thing!), managed to endure most of them and enjoy the movie.
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Post by Dhark on May 26, 2018 10:47:29 GMT -5
Caught an opening showing also.
I personally felt it tried a little too hard at times to be funny, and provided far too many literal tongue in cheek moments. Especially with choreography of a certain holonet communication. Yes i expected the person, but the ACTIONS while speaking were just stupid and unnecessary.
L7 was poorly executed IMO.
The actors, I think were well casted... I befrudgingly say in hindsight. Yes there were more “Harrison Ford-esque” options, but this guy actually performed Han Solo quite well— rolling with his successes AND failures with perfect alpomb.
All in all, by and far better than TPM and TFA (the worst of the worst IMO). I liked it better than TLJ and TCW. I’m still trying to decide where it’s at from there. Another viewing or three should help me decide.
For what it’s worth— Rogue One currently holds #1 in my book.
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Post by takewithfood on May 30, 2018 16:29:29 GMT -5
Solo might be the first Star Wars movie I skip in theater. I say "might be" not because I might change my mind, but because I honestly can't recall if I saw Revenge of the Sith in theaters or not. I do distinctly remember facepalming through Vader's giant "NooOOOOOOoooo!" and then laughing like Jack Nicholson's Joker when he sees himself for the first time in the mirror, but I don't remember if I was in the theater or at home. Anyway, it looks okay, but I just don't care at all about "Some Stuff A Young Han Solo Did This One Time: A Star Wars Story". I mean they just ran him through the fucking heart with a goddamn light saber a few years ago, then Luke evaporated, and Carrie Actual Fisher died. I don't know why they thought audiences would be universally in the mood for this. For reference, I think my order of preference for Star Wars movies, from favourite to least goes: Empire A New Hope Return of the Jedi Force Awakens* - gaping chasm - Rogue One - more chasm - Last Jedi the prequels in literally any order, who even cares My appreciation for The Force Awakens is based a lot on where I hoped the film would lead a sequel (you fooled me again, JJ). But the sequel we got was so utterly bizarre that I find I don't really hold it against TFA, and I find myself in a state of disbelief, like I'm still waiting for the ACTUAL continuation of the story. I think at some point, probably after Episode IX comes out, I'll realize that it was never going to amount to anything and it'll drop down the list a lot. But for now it sits where it sits, mostly on the merits of how much I love Kylo Ren as a villain. I guess I'm just done with Star Wars. At some point during the lengthy finale of The Last Jedi, I came to the realization that I only really liked two, sorta three Star Wars movies out of what is shaping up to be at least a dozen. And I liked them as a kid. Star Wars just isn't for me, and that's okay.
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Post by Manah on Jun 1, 2018 19:26:06 GMT -5
I will personally be a lot meaner - or kinder for the prequels, I guess - but I will try to do so in a polite and calm way. My favorite Star Wars movies were, in order... A new Hope Return of the Jedi Empire Strikes Back (Odd, I know. I love the Battle of Hoth and the Bespin scenes, but I was bored out of my mind during the Dagobah parts.) Revenge of the Sith (Yeah, I know, it has a lot of horrible parts, but it had a lot of parts I liked too.) Attack of the Clones The Phantom Menace (While I didn't dislike it too bad like many people, Jar Jar should not exist, Darth Maul was a complete waste of a character, and the way Anakin was handled made no damn sense.) I haven't seen neither Rogue One nor Solo (I heard a lot about them though) so I can't comment on those. As for Force Awakens and The Last Jedi... I'm afraid I'm going to have to be a lot harsher. FA was a poor man's A New Hope, little more than a fanfiction of someone entirely lacking anything close to an imagination who just took the old movie and copy-paste different pictures and audio on top of it. Rey is an absolute Mary Sue who essentially does not train and yet excels at everything she does immediately even though all the greatest of the great had to train for years to reach results half as satisfying as hers. Finn started as a great character whose potential turns out to be juuuust a little less wasted as Darth Maul was in I, Poe is one of the very few people who actually makes sense in the story only to be ignored and stomped over by everyone else for the dumbest of reasons, Snoke is just as much of a waste as Maul is in I, Captain Phasma is about as wasted as Grievous in III - as in a puppet of the big bads who die too quickly when they could have had a much bigger impact - Rose neither makes sense nor leaves an impression as anything but a nuisance to a possible great character end in Finn's heroic sacrifice, Holdo was... was... RRRRRRRWWWWWAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRGHHHHHH!!!!!
...Uff... uff. Sorry.
As for Solo dying... sure, I can see it. Okay.
Luke? ...Now, THAT was nothing less than an absolute insult to everything Star Wars ever stood for. In my book, I mean. I'm not claiming my opinion to be the absolute truth. But I will say that having him die like that, after essentially cowering away on a distant planet when all his and his friend's efforts were absolutely rendered useless by the new movies - as in, defeating the Empire did literally nothing in the end - is an abomination that needs to die itself.
Leia who flies in space? ...She who barely got basic Jedi training? Flying. One of the most difficult, highest level and rarest powers of Force users in the SW universe. And she just happens to do it there, because 'hey it'll look cool'.
And finally, killing off Ackbar by him just 'being there' where a blast hits the bridge of his ship and blows him to hell like nobody's business. Holdo's !"/$%?&* heroic death should have been his. He deserved this much.
I think the only decently written character among them was Kylo Ren, and even in his case, the way he was written at times gave me goosebumps.
My conclusion: As far as I'm concerned, Disney can go to hell, the Force awakens and the Last Jedi did not happen and I could not care less about IX if I tried. Solo and Rogue One I will watch one day, although I will feel pain in my heart for not seeing Kyle Katarn in the latter. And I will retain the good parts of the EU as my head canon as opposed to this garbage they call the official canon. Apologies for anyone who actually likes it, I respect your opinion and bless your heart if it pleases you. As far as I'm concerned, though, the Star Wars movies' worth died along with the Second Death Star chronologically, and with the Jedi Order in order of publication, though I may push this latter one later if Rogue One and Solo are as good as their supporters claim they are. On that note, I have ranted long enough. Live long and prosper, may the Force be with you, you guys are awesome.
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Post by takewithfood on Jun 2, 2018 6:47:41 GMT -5
Quick reply that probably doesn't need spoiler tags at this point, but: This might be the most common complaint about TLJ, but I don't quite understand it. I agree that it looked a bit silly, but Leia was in space. It takes only a minuscule amount of force to propel oneself in zero G (even less in a total vacuum than what's seen in that video!). It shouldn't be much harder than Luke pulling his lightsaber to him in the cave on Hoth, which he did before the bulk of his training. I don't think it's unreasonable at all to assume that after ~30+ years of being aware of the force, and being the sister of the only Jedi in the galaxy, Leia might pick up at least this much. I agree with everything else, though, especially the problems with Rey and Luke.
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