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Post by pgholland on Dec 16, 2006 10:18:32 GMT -5
Also Sorcery is not bound by Restriction 4- doesn't take a panel to prepare. And yes it does have 'unlimited power' but as it says in the magic description '1 stone of magic is the same stone as 1 stone in any other action' and as sorcery's ability to do 'anything' is limited by GM caveat (that's written in the Comments section it says your GM can just say 'No') Not to mention the fifth sentence which says "you're still spendind red stones, and they work just like any other red stones".
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Post by Scriptus on Dec 18, 2006 11:58:53 GMT -5
I wonder why the Mastery of Magic isn't worked the same way as the other masteries. Just add a couple of levels for the broader scope of magic and be done with it. I know there are a bunch of other options that go along with magic, but why not make them options for the masteries?
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Post by thedragonmaster on Dec 18, 2006 18:37:54 GMT -5
That was effectively the reason I started this thread. (Trying to rework mastery of magic to work like the other masteries.) Just a thought here, Mastery of Magic (from the book) is said to come with some basic abilities (Magical Barrier, Magic Blast, and so forth), so if we are to rework the Mastery, why not leave those the same and have the other options be the ones that increase the cost level? (since the other options are the ones that would be indicative of the Branch of Magic being used.) Any thoughts?
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Post by Brainstem on Dec 18, 2006 19:18:07 GMT -5
I would say to treat it as a mastery with the options all costing an appropriate amount and just do away with the limitations. Then its just as balanced as any other mastery, in that you can have just as many stones to do the same types of things, simply with a different element.
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Post by Neros on Feb 27, 2007 8:46:49 GMT -5
I was looking through the House Rule file i created (and working on a PC character). I thought about reworking Magical Travel (and the House Ruled Mastery of Magic), by removing the "Travel" options from Mastery of Magic and make a alternate version of Magical travel (or maybe even the same). What do you all say to that? (offcourse, Dragonmaster allready wanted to use that idea, so im pretty sure you agree on it ) Also, i like some of the limitations to the action (like takes a panel), but restricting it to effects which can't exceed 6 seems really limiting (especially if you have paid +6 for it). Theres also some other options for mastery of magic which could become abit more usefull/broader (Herbalism, love Charm), and others which dosent really need to be there (familiar).
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Post by malice on Feb 27, 2007 16:07:14 GMT -5
About restricting it to 6: This is a smart leash to put on that action, I don't know if people realize how powerful the ability to spend stones for Duration is. This isn't panels, but duration on the D&R chart. I made a character once who had acid breath, it was just a force blast with decreased ranged and a duration of 2. Duration 2 is 10 PANELS, if he got any stones through defense they would likely be dead before the 10 panels were up.
The more I learn about Mastery of Magic the more I appreciate it. I dislike that it never explains how many of the options masters of magic get that are listed. I run it as you get the options you take as specializations.
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Post by Neros on Feb 27, 2007 16:58:08 GMT -5
Another thing: I like the "taking a panel", but it seems like allot when dealing with small effects... How about, effects from 1-4 stones dont take a Panel to perfom, but effects from 5-10 takes a panel to prepare.
But is there any suggestions for Herbalism? I mean, simply increasing the natural healing rate of someone dosent sound worth a +1 (especially if that +1 means 5w stones)... For Love Charm, ive been thinking about just making it "Charms", and make the user able to make different types of charms... Love, Friendship, Anger, ect...
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Post by WildKnight on Apr 30, 2007 19:39:18 GMT -5
Im going to have to side with Brainstem. I think Mastery of Magic is okay as its presented. I've played with MoM using characters (in my groups, Ive never run one) and I've always found them to be somewhat limited. I mean sure, you can do almost anything... but on the other hand you only get an action every other panel alot of the time, and you're still limited by the number of stones you have. Its not like you can do everything *at once*.
And MoM is costly. You can add Psycho-Centric Power Template to get free stones for it... but tahts very costly too.
Besides.... you're concerning yourself with MoM... have you even looked at Telepathy? A Telepath can (using the rules as written) take over the mind of a large number of very powerful combatants (say Blob, Colossus, and Sabretooth) IN ONE PANEL, and then hold them in thrall for one stone per panel per character afterward.
I know Jean is supposed to be powerful, but come on... if she could do all that the bad guys would never, ever stand a chance.
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Post by thanos on Apr 30, 2007 20:51:52 GMT -5
I agree with those saying that MoM doesn't need a new write up or reworking. GM/Players just have to actually look at it for what it is and play with the actual limitations given. Telepathy as given, with Area Effect is dangerous, but so are a number of powers with the certain options. Its a game of give and take and making an effective 40 stone character is IMHO an art form.
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Post by WildKnight on Apr 30, 2007 21:05:37 GMT -5
Yeah, there are any number of powers that can be dangerous... but Telepathy is the most inherently abusable power. Project Thoughts/Control others... buy it as your only option... hell, throw in the "Cant Read Minds" limitation to get Control Others for a song...
Jack up your AN. Buy Psycho-Centric Power Template. Spend 9 stones per panel (you can afford it, since in future round you'll only be spending 1 per character you control...) to get control of 1 or 2 opponents. If you're not happy with your 2 people you're controlling, do it again next panel. Now you've got 3-4 characters under your control. Assuming the bad guys have any more people left, if you've chosen wisely, you can make short work of whatevers left. And the best part? Once you're in, you own the guy as long as you can keep spending 1 stone per panel to control them... their will is no longer relevant.
I dont think anything else in the game touches Telepathy for sheer abusability.
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Post by malice on Apr 30, 2007 22:23:59 GMT -5
Telepathy was like that in the comic books too. Most of the telepaths are portrayed as not wanting to abuse their power, but when they did? Did you ever read the Weapon X: the Draft issues? Agent Zero is one of my favorite characters, but that effing telepath Mesmero completely ruins the image.
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Post by WildKnight on May 1, 2007 5:51:26 GMT -5
Mesmero has to look people in the eyes, thereby forcing him to only target one person at a time.
I can't think of a single time in the comics that a single Telepath has ever completely dominated the will of multiple opponents with so little effort.
Normal people? Sure. Meta-Humans? No.
More imporantly, even if that were the case in comics, it makes for an awfully unbalanced game. If theres a powerful Telepath in a group of heroes they're untouchable, unless you put a powerful telepath in every group of villains, or come up with silly deus ex machina's like giving your villains helmets that ignore Telepathy, etc.
Again, I submit this to you... if Telepathy is as powerful in the comics as its presented in the game... why wasn't pre-Phoenix Jean Grey the most dominant member of the X-Men. The Brotherhood of Mutants and the Marauders would have never stood a chance against her.
"Oh, look, Sabretooth, I think I'll carjack his brain..."
Instead she stood by and watched helplessly while Sabretooth and Wolverine fought brutal, bloody battles. I seriously doubt her "ethics" kept her from saving Wolverine's life. Im more inclined to believe that its just not that simple to latch onto someones mind and make them your puppet.
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Post by thanos on May 1, 2007 15:55:00 GMT -5
Then again, Sabertooth and Wolverine are suppose to be trained or enhanced or something to be feral and extremely hard to take over mentally.
Perhaps a fix for Telepathy is to make the Telepath pay the stones for the Controlled characters actions. Yeah, you can paralize them with TP, just like a couple of other things, but to actually get them to do something you have to pay the stones to force them or create an elaberate enough illusion to get them to lash out or walk or whatever.
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Post by WildKnight on May 1, 2007 17:12:12 GMT -5
I like your thinking Thanos. And it works well with the fact that Illusions comes free with the Project Thoughts/Control Others option.
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Post by malice on May 1, 2007 19:00:25 GMT -5
That sounds a bit like the army control rules presented in the Spidey book. I don't remember them perfectly though, and my present computer is nothing if not extremely limited.
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