Past D12

[Deleted]

I've been runing a game of D&D for a few friends IRL for the past few months and we recently moved over to a variation of Cortex Plus based generally off of MH. Rather then using distinctions I've opted to use the various attributes from D&D that the characters already had and translated them into various die sizes. The trouble I have is that once players or monsters his 22 points of something I hit the D12 with the way I've worked things out. Not exactly a problem the players are likely to run into as I had said upright that I was limiting people to no more then 18 on any given attribute even when improving with level ups. This is more problematic with monsters and races that have higher stats however.

After thinking about it for a little bit I don't see a huge problem with extending the exsisting logic of using die steps and simply filling in d14, d16, and d18, with a final limit of things at the d20 level. My alternative is to use SFX to represent things with higher attribute levels. The trouble with that is the difference in scope between something like a werewolf who might have 25 strength (and thus be over what I've set as a d12 rating) and say.. a dragon with as much as 46 strength.

I'm mostly looking for some input on how people with more experiance with the system feel about the idea, I'm aware that I've completely changed the scale of what those dice represent in comparison to MH.

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Anything I think of going forward that could be a complication on this I'll list here. I'll do the same for any issued and adjustments that come out of this thread as well.

- obviously anything that had a d14 or higher effect die could one hit anything given the normal max of d12 stress/complication limit. In response I think I'm going to set the max stress/trauma/complications something can take as equal to its Con/Int/Wis for physical/mental/emotional effects respectively.

[Brainstem]

I think SFX are the way to go. Consider that the Dragon, for example, can have extra solo dice to represent the greater level of threat.

[takewithfood]

I'm working on a D&D reskin for Marvel Heroic, and I figure you just have to accept a certain amount of wiggle room. In the same way that The Hulk is d12 Strength + a bunch of SFX, epic D&D characters (and monsters) will have to make do with a very tight power scale.

As a guideline, I set up these benchmarks:

no trait = average (with limits representing particular weakness)
1d6 = exceptional
1d8 = monstrous
1d10 = legendary
1d12 = epic

"Exceptional" d6 is sort of the equivalent of a very high attribute score at 1st level. A 1st level character has at least one 1d6, and could have 2 or 3, depending how they spend their starting steps. "Monstrous" d8 is, as the name suggests, the territory for big monsters. Ogres have d8 Strength, pixies have d8 Charisma, Displacer Beasts have d8 Reflexes, etc. "Legendary" d10 is for advanced monsters: true giants, huge air elementals, and so forth. And "Epic" d12 is for the most terrifying monsters: elder dragons, for example.

Likewise, a fighter who finds Gloves of Ogre Power gets to step up his d6 Strength up to d8; now he's as strong as an Ogre.

SFX can help fill in the gaps, especially with very specific details. A sturdy Dwarf might have more than just 1d6 Stamina, he might have "SFX: Dwarven Constitution. Spend 1 PP to ignore stress, trauma, or complications from poisons."

I haven't tested it all yet, but when the rules are a little more complete I'll put them up and scrouge up a quick test event.

~TWF

[Deleted]

I initially had similar thoughts, but one of the things I do like about DnD is the capacity to get into more fine details between characters. So I opted to have the dice relate a smaller total range of ability in more detail. It looked like this:

10-11 = no die - normal
12-14 = d6 - gifted
15-17 = d8 - human limit
18-20 = d10 - common humanoid limit (max dex for an elf is an example)
21-23 = d12 - monstrous creatures

I figured for anything over d12 I'd just use some sfx, then I went to reuse an old character as an NPC and his a pump when I tried to translate the 28 strength he had by virtue of being a half dragon. That got me thinking of the potential trouble of creatures that had abilities well over my effective 23 point ceiling. I suppose I could just pile several SFX onto characters that would have much higher abilities.. I'll have to look at and play with some of my options there.

[takewithfood]

Oh, I should mention that another change I made is replacing Affiliations with basic attributes: Instead of assigning a d6, d8, and d10 to Solo, Buddy, and Team, you assign them to Physical, Mental, and Social. And you use those affiliations depending on how you're attempting a task.

That adds a little more wiggle room for distinguishing characters from each other. This badly needs testing, though.

~TWF

[Deleted]

That's essentially what I did as well, called them 'Steel, Guile, and Sorcery' instead to maintain more flavour with the game setting. So far it's worked out quite well in the two sessions we've played so far.

[takewithfood]

Nice! I'd love to hear more about how the game is going as it progresses. ^__^

~TWF

[Deleted]

So far the only issue I've run into with the MH conversion is that people tend to try really hard to find ways to use their best aptitude (thats what I called steel, guile and sorcery). Not a huge problem its just that sometimes I have to reign them in on that or have them give me a good reason that they can use guile instead of steel. I expect that there might be some trouble with people who had a d10 in sorcery wanting to use it for everything as well and having a decent rationality that simply using magic in an action makes it appropriate for sorcery to be used as well. Despite having magic all my players are either guile or steel focused though so that hasn't come up yet thankfully.