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Post by Ushima911 on Apr 2, 2019 12:43:48 GMT -5
Buying tickets today...now I just wait as I rock in the corner with my tickets in hand..
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Post by ZehnWaters on Apr 26, 2019 8:52:03 GMT -5
What'd everyone think? I've heard mixed to positive reviews!
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Post by Kaimontfendo on Apr 27, 2019 12:07:06 GMT -5
Incredibly fun, but long, and slow to start. (At just over three hours, it's longer than Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice, but it's not nearly as boring.) Oh, and don't bother waiting through the credits; there's literally nothing.
There's one character I hoped they would use, but they didn't. Also, I spotted a potential plot hole, but maybe it'll be covered in a future movie, so I won't complain about it just yet.
Overall, I'd say it's an awesome movie, with some cool twists and turns. 12/10
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Post by Gris on Apr 30, 2019 12:52:38 GMT -5
Just watched it mere minutes ago. Loved it. Maybe technically not spoilers, but just in case tagged it as such. Cried three times.
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Post by Ushima911 on Apr 30, 2019 13:11:11 GMT -5
Girlfriend surprised me with tickets, and the next day my cousins surprised me with tickets. Got to see it twice in one weekend. Very much enjoyed it as well. Had SOME (very little..) issues with it, but I very much enjoyed it. Also technically not a spoiler, but I liked Infinity war much more than this one. This one was definitely like a love letter to all the years we've held onto these characters, and that was great. However, because of that I believe that the sentimentality of it all will boost this movie's score higher than it maybe should be, and I'm completely fine with that. It has been many years, after all.
Hail Hydra.
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Post by takewithfood on Apr 30, 2019 17:28:09 GMT -5
Just got back. It was fantastic. They took a lot of victory laps, one of which (the female group photo op towards the end) was unnecessary, but otherwise were all very well earned and enjoyable.
The only thing that has me scratching my head is what this all means for the Black Widow movie that is set to start filming soon. My guess has always been that it would be at least partially set in the past, specifically the period where Clint and Nat were on opposite sides. That should be possible with a little makeup and maybe a touch of de-aging where necessary. I had hoped that it would also have ramifications on the present, too, but I guess that's out of the question now. Or at least I hope it is: I hope they don't get into the habit of bringing people back from the dead too often. Even if it is set in the past, it's going to end on a downer note knowing it's the last we'll see of her, and that she won't get a happy ending.
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Post by Ushima911 on Apr 30, 2019 17:34:48 GMT -5
I am optimistic about them not bringing people back from the dead TWF. This was a cosmic-scale kinda thing, one I have hope they won't be doing for awhile. (Super big power-scaled super heroes don't interest me too much.) Besides, it's not like that have a pool that can bring people back to life, and call it a Lazarus pit or something, that'd be CRAAAZZZY...
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Post by roxolid on May 2, 2019 4:02:05 GMT -5
Not done a spoiler before so I hope this works. Thankfully most of you lot will be in bed as you're stateside for the most part...
With the time travel/quantum realm thing it does beg the question why anything should 'stick' in the MU any more. Pluck a version that was about to die in another time stream and start over in this one.
Also, I know the CGI thing means characters with masks on are a big issue (why hire/pay an expensive actor if all you use is their voice?) but Spiderman whipping his mask off and announcing "I'm Peter Parker" to anyone new that shows up... Where's the rolling eye emoji...
I can't remember but did Tony have his helmet off in the battle against big purplechin? If so, why didn't he just one shot him?
Not a fan of Captain Marvel in the comics or the movies. What I saw here does not change things. I'll always think of her as Marvels Space Mary Sue.
So, did Cap really take the soul stone back to the Red Skull? How did that go?
I'm glad Thor resembles most of the over 40 male audience now. *Cough* really need to hit the weights again *cough* There's probably more but I just want to make sure this spoiler thing works.
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Post by roxolid on May 2, 2019 4:02:19 GMT -5
Yay! No spoilers on show! It gets a 7/10 for me. I came out thinking "That was ok". That's it. They didn't drop the ball, all the favourites were in there for one last hurrah/huge payday/thank god that's over reunion now can I go back to acting in Rom Coms etc (delete as applicable). Hulk was a huge disappointment on the one hand and yet quite fun, just like in Infinity war. His healing factor should have cleaned his arm up in moments and if it did that to near invulnerable/super fast healing hulk it should have instantly cooked Stark in a nanosecond. But hey, they pay RDJ a lot of money and it's his signing off thing, so whatever. Happy for Cap, Hulk was upset but not devastated over Black Widow so not sure about that. Oh, and Black Widow. Is this a '10 years ago, Budapest' story we should expect or some kind of time mangling resurrection we should expect from her movie? Main question for me is, where to now? I'm not a great fan of the Spiderman films, I like Black Panther, Doc Strange is so/so and it's going to be tricky for the movie going public to adapt to anyone else being Captain America after so many films. More space based stuff? Fantastic Four/X men (that's not going to confuse anyone when those reboots arrive. Much...)? Eternals has been mentioned, but I genuinely don't know much about them. For me they were always B list in terms of comics. I think overall I'd like a rest from supers. Bring back Science Fiction! But not more crappy star wars films
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Post by takewithfood on May 2, 2019 7:27:17 GMT -5
So to address some of the questions and issues Roxolid brought up, as well as answering one of my own lingering questions about the film: My first question after watching the movie was: "Wait, WTF just happened with Cap and time travel?" I couldn't tell if we were meant to assume that Captain America went back in time and secretly married Peggy Carter without anyone noticing. That seems not only impossible ("Wow, Peggy, your new husband sure looks like Steve Rogers!") but it's also not how time travel is supposed to work in their universe: if you go back in time and change too much, you should create a separate timeline. But if Steve created a second timeline by marrying Peggy (or anyone else for that matter) then how did he get back to the main timeline? WTF is going on?
Well the Russo brothers recently answered this question... sort of:
So it's a little disappointing that we aren't given enough information in the actual movie to put this together, but I guess it's reasonable with a little extra info. In theory by the time Cap is old man Cap they might have figured out some kind of dimensional-hopping technology that could have returned him to that moment to say goodbye. That's a terrifying thought, though: There is a cannon 2nd dimension with the technology to bridge into the prime timeline. Maybe that never comes up again in the MCU, but maybe some writer uses it as a means to justify some weird plotline...
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With regards to the can of worms the MCU opened just by creating time travel, I think they can mostly close it again by taking the Pym particles out of the equation. Pym does not share his technology lightly, and would probably take even more drastic measures to hide/destroy his own technology to prevent exactly this kind of mess. That could create interesting problems for Ant Man. Might be interesting fallout, or it might never get mentioned again.
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Quick note about Captain Marvel: I think we're stretching the concept of a Mary Sue by applying it too strongly to her. She's powerful and bland as a character, and I'll even argue that she's a bit of a stand in for some feminist power fantasies, but there's more to a Mary Sue than that. I don't think her raw power is necessarily an issue either, since Dr Strange is arguably more powerful (maybe not in raw destructive power but certainly in breadth and scope), so really the main issue with her is her character and story arc - or utter lack thereof.
I had hopes that the Russo brothers would manage to add something to her, but they instead chose to kinda nudge her off screen for 95% of the film; I understand and am pretty okay with this choice, too. I don't blame them: Endgame was not as much of a vehicle for promoting upcoming Marvel products as I feared it would be; it is almost purely a sendoff, as well as a bit of a victory lap for everyone who contributed to this 11-year saga. I still have hopes that they can salvage her character, give her more personality (preferably a likeable one) and a storyline we can look forward to. I mean I would probably pay money to see a movie called "Captain Marvel Flies Through Space Ships For Two Hours" but I think they can do better.
====================================================================
As for the future of the MCU in general, they have several release dates booked and a few movies known or suspected to be in development. Here's what I know, along with best guesses at which movies match which release dates:
* May or November 2020? - Black Widow: This is alleged to be set in the recentish past (early aughts?), co-starring Hawkeye, during the period where Natasha was first recruited into SHIELD. Probably lots of Nick Fury, too, and maybe another Coulson cameo? Filming begins in June so this is probably the first movie we're going to see in Phase 4. I don't know if they can get it done in time for May of next year. It probably won't have an insane special effects budget so maybe it's possible. Otherwise it looks destined for the fall.
* Feburary 2021 - Black Panther 2: The first one made a ton of money so you know they're coming back for more. Marvel has a February date set, and since Black Panther set records for a February release you can bet this is what they have in mind. No details known yet, but I'm sure there's a lot they can do.
* November 2020/May 2021? - Eternals: After the surprise success of Guardians of the Galaxy I don't blame them for seeking out another weird space romp. I think Guardians' success had more to do with the knockout cast, great visual work, soundtrack, and cast than the source material though, so they have their work cut out for them. If they really are following the Guardians mould, they are probably basing this movie largely off the 2006 Neil Gaiman soft reboot of the series where mindwiped Eternals are living on Earth or something like that. So far we know Angelina Jolie has been cast, probably playing Sersi. They have also booked Chinese director Chloe Zao and allegedly secured famous Korean actor Ma Dong-seok; gotta get that Asian money baby. I'm pretty skeptical overall but I still trust Marvel. It is set to start filming this year, so maybe they get it done in time for November 2020 IF they also get BW done in time for the May release. Seems doubtful though, so I place it in a safer slot following all the Black Panther hype in May 2021.
* Fall 2021??? - Shang Chi: I don't know how I feel about this one, but Marvel is rumoured to be fast-tracking a Shang-Chi film. It's hard to see this as more than an attempt to pander to the huge Chinese boxoffice (and diversifying the MCU cast in general), but that doesn't mean it can't also be good. The trouble is that I don't know where this comes out. If Marvel doesn't get one of its movies, most likely Black Widow, into the May 2020 slot, this is where we get a bit of a logjam. Some project will have to be scrapped.
* Fall 2021??? - Doctor Strange 2: Cumberbatch still has a few movies in his contract, and he's one of the heavy-hitters in the MCU. I'm sure they'll at least try to put something together. We're in very unknown territory here as these movies aren't even in pre-production yet. However, the first Dr. Strange came out in the fall, so this seems like a good fit. I wonder if it will involve a Thor and/or Captain Marvel crossover. It could also serve as an introduction to Shang Chi.
* Summer 2022??? - Guardians Vol 3: This is apparently pretty early in development, but we know it's happening. Guardians is now their most financially secure product (this might change depending on how Far From Home does) so you know they're making another. And it looks like it will involve Thor, so that's guaranteed bank. The difficulty is that James Gunn is tied up making the Suicide Squad reboot throughout 2020 at best. This is probably the biggest slam-dunk project in Phase 4 so they don't have to release it right away, but it's awkward. It's just weird to me that Thor 4 is not yet in development despite both Chris Hemsworth and director Taika Waititi being eager to get to work. Are we really going to wait up to 3 years to see Thor again? That makes no financial sense. If I'm Marvel I want Thor back on screen ASAP.
Spider-Man 3, Captain Marvel 2, and Ant Man 3 are also all rumoured to be in the works, but that's stretching into very unknown territory. It remains to be seen if the MCU can maintain the success it had under the Big Three without them, and if the superhero genre still has legs 3+ years from now. I doubt they will have any more Avengers movies, but I think they might try to repeat the success of crossover films like Civil War. We'll see.
Anyway, that's all I got.
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Post by ZehnWaters on May 2, 2019 9:16:59 GMT -5
As a teacher I'll leave a letter grade: B- Hulk was a huge disappointment on the one hand and yet quite fun, just like in Infinity war. His healing factor should have cleaned his arm up in moments and if it did that to near invulnerable/super fast healing hulk it should have instantly cooked Stark in a nanosecond. But hey, they pay RDJ a lot of money and it's his signing off thing, so whatever. I agree. Hipster Hulk wasn't what I was expecting or wanting. They kinda just dropped the WHY he couldn't Hulk out in Infinity War so we're left just having to assume it was a plot device. They also could have shaved off some time by not having him send Scott back in time since that was there purely for laughs. I'm guessing his arm didn't heal because of how powerful the Stones are. You're right in that it should have simply incinerated Tony but they had to give him a goodbye. I'm happy for Cap too but is he the husband she mentioned in Winter Soldier? I mean, we don't ever see him. If not, he took away her kids and husband which is kinda lame. As was brought up, why isn't he in an alternate timeline? I guess he didn't "change the past" as he was always her husband? Still is weird.
I'm also upset Widow didn't get a big fat send off like Tony. I guess because she's coming back? What even happens when you return the Soul Stone? Was Red Skull there for Steve when he got there? Someone said Skull said he gets released if it's not there, so maybe he wasn't there and only had to come back later? Regardless, she's tied to the Soul Stone so maybe her movie is her reliving her past as she's brought back to life? Would she even end up in the right timestream?
Speaking of that, they killed the Thanos from another timeline. Did anyone else find that unsatisfying? Oh look, a plot device followed us home, better tie it up! And what happens to the timeline he's from? It doesn't matter if they put the stones back in that reality it's splintered. And if the stones keep reality in check, what happens now that Thanos destroyed the stones in the Prime timeline?
As far as Thor's concerned, I thought it was funny for about 5 minutes and then it got old. While perhaps unrealistic for him to instantly return to being in shape, it's still what I wanted. But everyone like funny Thor from Ragnarok (except me, it would seem) so this is what we got. I'm not a huge fan of their Spider-Man either. I didn't like how they made Tony his father figure instead of Uncle Ben. I REALLY don't like how they changed literally every one around him from the comic's version. At this point I'm pretty much only interested in Doc Strange and GotG. Sorta Black Panther. AGREED. The fact that I'm not even kind of moved to see the next Star Wars film in theatres makes me both sad and angry.
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Post by ZehnWaters on May 2, 2019 9:42:42 GMT -5
With regards to the can of worms the MCU opened just by creating time travel, I think they can mostly close it again by taking the Pym particles out of the equation. Pym does not share his technology lightly, and would probably take even more drastic measures to hide/destroy his own technology to prevent exactly this kind of mess. That could create interesting problems for Ant Man. Might be interesting fallout, or it might never get mentioned again. I feel about time travel like the Rules to Being an Evil Overlord feel about turning into a snake. Don't do it, it never helps. This movie would have been far more satisfying if we'd watched them have a big fight against the Thanos who actually wronged them but, then, I don't think they thought we'd get to see Cap go be with Peggy. Despite having a TIME Stone. You're...right. Additional qualifications include being beloved by the original characters and being an author self-insert. While a feminist power-fantasy, that mostly just makes her a bland character. She really was Captain Deus ex Machina in this film, wasn't she? Most of those who are left are being shifted to Disney+ (WandaVision, Falcon, Winter Soldier, Hawkeye, Loki) so I think I agree with you: we're mostly going to get crossovers. Speaking of Loki, I'm assuming this is alternate past Loki that took off with the tesseract? And about that, why can he use that freely but Hulk is the one who has to use the gauntlet? Shouldn't Thor be more than strong enough? Why did we never get to see Hulk knock around some guys?[/spoilers]
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Post by Cernunnos on May 3, 2019 18:07:12 GMT -5
It was ok. Certain parts of it I liked. But I don't think it's as great as everyone has been saying. Honestly I liked Infinity War a little more. At the end of the day I guess it just wasn't my bag... baby. And after talking to my wife (and coworkers), I think I figured out why everyone (I talked to) wasn't so uppity up about the movie. I think when you deal with "Time travel" you have to do it just right, and anything under that makes it unacceptable. And it's a very tricky/shaky thing to get "right." Shows/movies like DBZ, Terminator (1-3) and Back to the Future II, do "time travel" right in my opinion. They are the epitome of what it means to time travel to the majority of us. Anything less is failure.
I think what Endgame failed to do was properly set the ground rules of time travel in their universe, and seemingly/vaguely dismissed it to their detriment.
So it was because of this concept a lot of people lost interest in the movie (or were confused). So in order to renew their interest in the movie in a more favorable light, I tried to put it to them like this: "Don't view Endgame as a time travel movie. View it as an Avengers movie that just so happens to have time travel." And with that thought in their heads they seemed to feel a little better about their movie experience as it was overall.
Just got back. It was fantastic. They took a lot of victory laps, one of which (the female group photo op towards the end) was unnecessary, but otherwise were all very well earned and enjoyable.
The only thing that has me scratching my head is what this all means for the Black Widow movie that is set to start filming soon. My guess has always been that it would be at least partially set in the past, specifically the period where Clint and Nat were on opposite sides. That should be possible with a little makeup and maybe a touch of de-aging where necessary. I had hoped that it would also have ramifications on the present, too, but I guess that's out of the question now. Or at least I hope it is: I hope they don't get into the habit of bringing people back from the dead too often. Even if it is set in the past, it's going to end on a downer note knowing it's the last we'll see of her, and that she won't get a happy ending.
About this. I heard that Disney (in particular the Marvel movie branch) has been messing around with and has used technology (as in it's available now) where they create a life-size scan of the actors so that they can use them in the future if they need to and they will look as they do now.
Speaking of this. I think I pieced together who the next "BIG" baddie will be... at first I was thinking Galactus... but after talking to a coworker, I'm now thinking it's going to be Kang/Imortus! I'm thinking he's going to get upset with other manipulating his time streams.
Anyways... that said. I hope they start doing some street level stuff soon, I was just talking to someone the other day that it might be cool to see something to where Boomerang, Stilt-Man, Owl, Cyclone, Jigsaw and Mad Jack appear and cause havoc in the streets. Perhaps even make an MCU Sinister Six version with some or all of these guys in it! That'd be cool. And perhaps after its all said and done and Fury takes their tech and they are locked away in prison, the cutscene shows that the tech was actually Tony's, just reworked...
Anyways something like that might be cool.
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Post by Ushima911 on May 3, 2019 18:36:17 GMT -5
I'm with ya there. Like I said before, super high powered heroes don't interest me as much anymore. The highest I'd like to see, at the VERY highest, would be Doom. MAYBE Onslaught if they could be dark enough to do it right. But yeah, street leveled heroes are pretty much on my radar right now.
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Post by takewithfood on May 3, 2019 20:41:36 GMT -5
Personally I like the street-level stuff more, too. I get a huge kick out of watching Carol Danvers blow stuff up, but ultimately I think my favourite fight scenes are the ones in Winter Soldier. Up close, personal, well-choreographed, and with minimal CGI. Black Panther and Spidey are sorta street-level still. Street-adjacent at most. Shang-Chi will probably come in around there, too, and then there's the Black Widow movie. Should be good. I don't know if there will be a looming "big bad" anymore. I think we're going to see a lot more crossovers and smaller story arcs that grow and evolve on their own, rather than trying to tie everything in to one big thing again. We'll see. EDIT: I'm probably pretty alone on this, but I'd love to see a Young Avengers movie - though probably not by that name. A team of young would-be heroes inspired by the Avengers would be pretty sweet right now, and a lot of the stage is set for it: Cassie Lang is grown up enough to be Stature, or close to it; Patriot could step up in the wake of Captain America stepping down; they could easily resurrect an adolescent, mind-stoneless version of Vision; I'd love to see Hawkeye train Kate Bishop, or possibly his own daughter, Lila, as the next Hawkeye (we saw him teaching her to shoot already; imagine how pissed his wife would be though omg). Speed or Wiccan haven't been set up, but they can be replaced; on the other hand, it would be nice to have some cannon gay characters. And how crazy would it be if they used Kang the Conqueror as the villain, with Iron Lad in the team, like in the comics?
It's probably too cheesy, and I'm wary of teen/young actors trying to carry a movie in the MCU, but otherwise I'd be all over that. A crossover with Spider-Man where he suddenly finds himself being the adult/veteran hero in front of all these newbies/wannabes would be hilarious.
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