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Post by i3ullseye on Jun 4, 2003 21:08:00 GMT -5
Someone suggested in another forum that the game was not detailed enough.
I would say that the intent is not to be OVER detailed, and instead be fast and flexible. But the idea is the game does not have enough detail for spideys web shooting.
Here is my take.....
If you want to see Spideys stats, head over to the main MURPG site and check out their sample pages. One is a stat page that has both Spidey and Rogue.
It lists Web Shooters [+6]
And then states he has 100 stones of fluid. Also if any stone of damage gets through you web the opponent.
Ok, fine. But is this enough?
Well, as an item, the +6 is free stones added to ranged combat. It is pretty friggen huge all things considered. I see where the confusion might come from, how do you handle the grapple? Well, it is just Force Blast with the extra that it can incapacitate people. Simple enough.
How can you counter it? Well, ALL of this is arbitrary in all cases, as it shoudl be for flavor. This is an effects based system, so not two instances need ever be identical. You woudl have to figure the strength needed to break these, or the damage done. Simple again, it is a Def of 6 (equal to the stones of the item itself) and a Resist equal to the amount of web used.
Spidey makes one stone over... you need to do 7 stones damage to break it. He makes 3 stones over, you need a 9. If you can't do at least the basic 6 stones of damage, you can not harm the web.
The webslinging itself is defined in the power, not in this item. The power lists the speed as 2X the listed running speed for the amount of stones used. It has a max of 125MPH. So if you sepnd 1 stone, you go double the speed of 1 stone of running. If you put 2 in you go double the speed of 2 stones, or 125MPH and hit max.
You need never go more than 2 stones for speed, extra stones are for carrying extra weight or odd maneuvers. So spidey has 100 stones of web in each cartridge. And he carried 26 cannisters. This pretty much sums that up also.
If he uses the stones for movement, or for an attack, the result is the same. Stones are used form the supply.
This could also be built with element mastery. With force blast (entangling), the enhanced movement, object creation (crude) and the wall creation (anchored only) all built in.
Sure, it is not spelled out letter by letter, but it certainly has everything you need to do all the actions Spidey does in the comics with it. And then some.
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Post by psistrike on Jun 4, 2003 23:17:25 GMT -5
How about trying this Action I came up with.
Entangle/Webbing:Cost Level=Action Number+1 Level Description:Many substances and devices can entangle or trap a target in a substance which is hard to escape from. It can be anything from spider-webbing to glue to energy nets.The choice is yours how the power looks and works.The way the power works in game-terms is that when you attack a target with this power if any damage over the target's defense get through(Note:Toughness and Body Armor don't count towards Defense for defending against this Action unless it is some superslick substance/armor.) your opponent is tangled in the substance and can't do any Physical-based Actions except try to escape while entangled. Base Range is 4 on the D&R Chart. The entanglement last 1 hour as a default(A 3 Duration on the D&R Chart.).This can be reduced at -1 to Cost Level per Duration number down on the D&R Chart(Ex.-1 to Cost Level would reduce the duration down to 10 panels or a 2 on the D&R Chart.) or increased at +1 to Cost Level per Duration number up on the D&R Chart(Ex.+1 to Cost Level would increase the duration to 500-1000 panels or a 4 on the D&R Chart.).I suggest a maximum Duration of 5 unless the Entangle/Webbing is supernatural and meant to hold a target for weeks to years. The Difficulty to break free equals the number of stones that got through Defense and Resistance is equal to the Action Number+1.Additional attacks with this Action that get through add +1 to Difficulty per successful attack (Max. Difficulty is Action Number(Spidey's webbing would be a 6.) and number of stones that get through Defense add to Resistance. The attempt to escape/break free can be done with any of these Abilities/Actions:Strength,Agility,Speed if it at least a 7(can vibrate at high speeds to break free),Acrobatics,Black Ops/Spying if you have the Escape speciality,Close Combat if you have the Sumo,Wrestling,or other appropriate Speciality,Growth(A special rule when using Growth to break free of Entangle/Webbing is each stone spent to grow acts as a free +1 sit. modifier for breaking free as sudden growth can break such bonds more easily then Strength alone),Phase Shift(this automatically escapes if the GM allows it to.),Shape Shifting if the substance can be escaped by altering size or shape some(Gm's option based on how Entangle/Webbing works.),Shrink(Depends on how the power works,Ex. An energy net could be escape using this but if Spiderman's webbing were covering you then there is little chance to escape by shrinking.),Stretching, Telekinesis in place of Strength,Teleportation(See Shrink for how this could work.),and Wallcrawling/Climbing. Any Action with an Ability Bonus(es) count them toward the action to escape/break free.Also the Gm can allow creative uses of other Actions to allow escape/break free of the Entangle/Webbing Action(Ex.Use of Force Blast to blast free,Force Field expanded outward to break the bondings or allow the trapped individual to squeeze free, Hex-Spheres to melt,etc. the Entangle/Webbing effect,etc.). Options:Can be made a Modifier at +3 to Cost Level.If made a Modifier it is a Modifier for Ranged Combat normally. Comments:A verstile power that can take many forms.Use you imagination to come up with new forms and remember to have fun with it and how you use it.Also remember that certain forms of this Action should have other actions to complement them(Spiderman for example has Wallcrawling and Web-Slinging to compliment this power.)
Hope you like it and would love to here your comments on it.
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Post by i3ullseye on Jun 4, 2003 23:32:38 GMT -5
I like it. Not sure I would personally use it though, just because it is a very complex writeup. Most of what you stated is what would be figured as the circumstances arise, so I guess yours just settles it all from the get go! So I actually like it. But there is one glaring thing that needs changed. According to the modifiers listed on page 40 clearly state what to do if a power disables someone if even one stone gets through is a +5 ranks cost modifier. It is incredibly powerful. Further you list it as ignoring some of the most critical defenses in the game. To ignore toughness completely is immense. This writeup, at even 1 stone over, coudl completely disable the Hulk ignoring a full +8 toughness? Nah, thats too much unless it costs out the nose. To simulate this you might take the attack versus enemy ability instead of defense stones. this is also listed on the chart on page 40, and it is a +6 advantage. So you are looking at a base +11 JUST for the combat aspects of this power alone. Great write-up.... but I fear it is a tad underpriced to say the least!
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Post by psistrike on Jun 5, 2003 0:00:10 GMT -5
I appreciate the comments but the advantage to disable if any damage occurs means the target is knocked out,paralyzed,turned to stone,etc. and can't act at all including Mental-based actions until the Gm says the disabling effect wears off(the turned to stone version could be made permanent at the Gm's option) but not to if the target is bound by something but has a chance to break.I figure that the ability to break free or escape the Entangle/Webbing effect was worth a -4 to Cost Level for that effect.Also you can still act to not only break free but can use any Action that the Gm says is mental-based such as Create Illusions,Hex-Spheres, Invisibility,Telekinesis,Telepathy,and many other actions. I guess I should have said that the Entangled/Webbed target can't do any physical-based Actions using the parts of his body that are Entangled/Webbing unless the Gm says the action can be done with little movement(Ex.Using Charge Objects if your hands are free,same with Fireworks or Force Blasts that come from a limb or part of body that isn't bound(Cyclops' Optic Blast), Stretching if the limb/body part isn't covered in the substance,etc.).Imagine Spiderman webbing up Toad but not Toad's face then having Toad spit slime in Spidey's face.
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Post by psistrike on Jun 5, 2003 0:21:51 GMT -5
Here is a modified/more description on what it can do version of the Entangle/Webbing Action.
Entangle/Webbing:Cost Level=Action Number+1 Level Description:Many substances and devices can entangle or trap a target in a substance which is hard to escape from. It can be anything from spider-webbing to glue to energy nets.The choice is yours how the power looks and works.The way the power works in game-terms is that when you attack a target with this power if any damage over the target's defense gets through(Note:Toughness and Body Armor don't count towards Defense for defending against this Action unless it is some superslick substance/armor.) your opponent is tangled in the substance and can't do any physical-based Actions using the parts of his body that are Entangled/Webbed unless the Gm says the action can be done with little movement(Ex. Using Charge Objects if your hands are free,same with Fireworks or Force Blasts that come from a limb or part of the body that isn't bound(ex.Cyclops' Optic Blast),Stretching if the limb/body part isn't covered in the substance,etc.Imagine Spiderman webbing up Toad but Toad's face then having Toad spit slime in Spidey's face.) except try to escape while entangled.(Note that entangling/webbing a specific limb or body only affects that limb or body part(Webbing or a constrictive gel over someone's eyes would effectively blind the target until removed,glue on someone's feet would prevent them from running or moving but they could still fight back,etc.) but requires the Specific effect Situational Modifier to do making it harder.)Note unless the Specific effect Situational Modifier is used to aim at a specific body part then the target of this Action is the main torso area of the body.(This may leave the hands free enough to use if Gm decides.) Base Range is 4 on the D&R Chart. The entanglement last 1 hour as a default(A 3 Duration on the D&R Chart.).This can be reduced at -1 to Cost Level per Duration number down on the D&R Chart(Ex.-1 to Cost Level would reduce the duration down to 10 panels or a 2 on the D&R Chart.) or increased at +1 to Cost Level per Duration number up on the D&R Chart(Ex.+1 to Cost Level would increase the duration to 500-1000 panels or a 4 on the D&R Chart.).I suggest a maximum Duration of 5 unless the Entangle/Webbing is supernatural and meant to hold a target for weeks to years. The Difficulty to break free equals the number of stones that got through Defense and Resistance is equal to the Action Number+1.Additional attacks with this Action that get through add +1 to Difficulty per successful attack (Max. Difficulty is Action Number(Spidey's webbing would be a 6.) and number of stones that get through Defense add to Resistance. The attempt to escape/break free can be done with any of these Abilities/Actions:Strength,Agility,Speed if it at least a 7(can vibrate at high speeds to break free),Acrobatics,Black Ops/Spying if you have the Escape speciality,Close Combat if you have the Sumo,Wrestling,or other appropriate Speciality,Growth(A special rule when using Growth to break free of Entangle/Webbing is each stone spent to grow acts as a free +1 sit. modifier for breaking free as sudden growth can break such bonds more easily then Strength alone),Phase Shift(this automatically escapes if the GM allows it to.),Shape Shifting if the substance can be escaped by altering size or shape some(Gm's option based on how Entangle/Webbing works.),Shrink(Depends on how the power works,Ex. An energy net could be escape using this but if Spiderman's webbing were covering you then there is little chance to escape by shrinking.),Stretching, Telekinesis in place of Strength,Teleportation(See Shrink for how this could work.),and Wallcrawling/Climbing. Any Action with an Ability Bonus(es) count them toward the action to escape/break free.Also the Gm can allow creative uses of other Actions to allow escape/break free of the Entangle/Webbing Action(Ex.Use of Force Blast to blast free,Force Field expanded outward to break the bondings or allow the trapped individual to squeeze free, Hex-Spheres to melt,etc. the Entangle/Webbing effect,etc.). Options:Can be made a Modifier at +3 to Cost Level.If made a Modifier it is a Modifier for Ranged Combat normally. Comments:A verstile power that can take many forms.Use you imagination to come up with new forms and remember to have fun with it and how you use it.Also remember that certain forms of this Action should have other actions to complement them(Spiderman for example has Wallcrawling and Web-Slinging to compliment this power.)
Please tell me if the description of how the Action works is better for the Cost Level now.
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Post by i3ullseye on Jun 5, 2003 0:32:56 GMT -5
Hehe, yeah, good point. But still, to completely ignore Toughness which is a Rank +3 cost ability is a bit much. Again, love the write-up... and msot of what you listed was how I envisionsed handling webs if they ever came up. But the cost seems a bit low. But notice in this game they don't sweat that stuff. Cap should pay for his shield, and Spidey for his web shooters, but most of the equipment rules just say 'wing it' basically. The call of spending stones on an item, or buying it with cash (or even inventing it) and how it impacts game balance is entirely arbitrary and up to the GM. So maybe the web shooters DO cost rank +10. It isn't listed because accorsding to the design concept, it doesn't matter. he is Spidey, he is just that cool! I eman Kang just has one item listed. And all it says is "Time Ship". Hahaha.... anyone want to try to cost that one out in stones? So some items for the pre-existant heros are best left un-analysed. I guess in the X-Men book it already lists new powers and other abilities. The nature of the marvel universe is very individual. ONLY Jubilee does fireworks. ONLY Bullseye has the throwing accurracy. ONLY Spiderman swings on webs. Etc..... Many powers are completely unique to the individual, so to call for uniformity would kill a lot of that flavor I think. But as an exercise...... Caps Shield! It is [+6] for Close Combat, Ranged Comabt and Defense... and is armor piercing. Lets break down JUST this one item. +6 for Close Combat is basically a modified version of Claws. We also add the armor piercing. The total for this is Rank +4 levels for Claws and another +3 levels for AP. So 6+4+3 = 13 or 30 WHITE STONES! Yes, thats 30 White! And the exact same formula for the ranged component since it woudl be bought as Targeting, another +4 level power. So we are at 60 White stones. Now the defense. there is no physical defense, this woudl be Reflexive Dodge. Toughness woudln't apply, becaue AE overomes the shield. So Reflexive is a +3 level cost. But looking at toughness, we have to take +1 rank because it cancels Armor Piercing, since the shield IS immune to this. So we are looking at 6+4 or a rank of 10. This is another 15 white stones. But looking back over, it is an item, so it can not be increased by lines. We can reduce EACH component by 2 lines. Being generous we can even say BEING a device is the same scale as the power being out of control without a device, so another -2 modifier. lets remove 4 ranks from each component then..... +6 close combat = rank +3 or level 9. This is 12 Stones. +6 Ranged combat = rank +3 or level 9. This is 12 Stones. +6 reflexive dodge = rank +0 or level 6. This is 4 stones. So a conservative cost is 28 white stones for the Shield alone.
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Post by i3ullseye on Jun 5, 2003 2:57:32 GMT -5
Note: Moved this here to this new forum since a section for rules discussion is going to be needed.
Hehe, slight oversight on my part.
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Post by PeytonWestlake on Jun 23, 2003 10:30:32 GMT -5
Hmm... Well, IMHO, the sorcery ability is a little over powered. When my group ran through the sample adventure, one of the players used a created character (a sorcerer). In each of the fights with the Brotherhood of Evil Mutants, he was able to quickly take Blob out of the fight by using a sleep spell on him. This left our 2 remaining characters (Punisher and the sorcerer character) vs. Mystique in the Nightclub and vs. Mystique & Toad in the final battle (as the other two characters in our group were Daredevil and Wolverine).
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Post by digitalronin on Jul 7, 2003 7:23:36 GMT -5
Under Sorcery, Sleep explicitly says it can NOT be used in combat. Stun can be used though but it's vs. the target's durability.
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