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Post by psistrike on Jul 24, 2003 17:17:38 GMT -5
Here is a new Action I thought up.Tell me what you think and if I should adjust the Cost Level.
Psi-Armor:Cost Level=Action Number+6 Levels Description:Generate a poweful armor(can appear in any form) from your own mental energy to be used as a Weapon Modifier with Close Combat and acts as Force Field(Limited to defending you) adding to Defense equal to the AN activated.Stones remain in the Psi-Armor Box and may be reused until combat is over.You may use this in the same Panel you create it.This works basically like Psi-Weapon in that after you spend stones on it they act as a Weapon Modifier for the rest of combat without further need of energy. *The following Actions and Modifiers can be bought at a discount of -1 to the Cost Level if they can only be used/are active when the Psi-Armor is active: Fireworks,Flight,Force Blast,Unstoppable,Wall-Crawling/Climbing, Blasting,Energy Defense,Magical Defense,Mental Defense,Radar Senses,Reflexive Dodge,Sonar Sense,and Enhanced Vision. Options:*Exo-Strength:+1 to Cost Level.When active the Psi-Armor increases Strength by 1 for every 2 levels of Psi-Armor active,rounded down,maximum Strength 10. *Swift Armor:+1 to Cost Level:When active the Psi-Armor increases Speed by 1 for every 2 level of Psi-Armor active,rounded down,maximum Speed 10. *Reflexive Armor:+1 to Cost Level.When active the Psi-Armor increases Agility by 1 for every 2 levels of Psi-Armor active,rounded down,maximum Agility 10. *Convert to Modifier:Turning this into a Modifier adds +2 to Cost Level but then you can't increase it with lines of experience. Comments:A powerful attack and defense power,their are only a few who have this power though.Can get very expensive to purchase at levels higher then 4.Surprise your opponents by suddenly being in armor.Great Action when combined with Close Combat. Rules for Action Box:*Create mental power armor.*Combine with Close Combat as a Weapon Modifier.*Defense:Force field-like armor with +1 to Defense per stone active.*(Exo-Strength Option;+1 Strength/2 Levels active,limit 10)*(Swift Armor Option;+1 Speed/2 Levels active,limit 10)*(Reflexive Armor;+1 Agility/2 Levels active,limit 10) Example:Sapphire Knight is a mutant who has Psi-Armor Action Number of 5 with Exo-Strength Option.He puts 5 stones into Psi-Armor and produces a glowing blue knight-style armor which he can use with Close Combat as a +5 Weapon Modifier,adding to it his Close Combat stones,adds +5 to his Defense as long as it's active,and adds +2 to his Strength when active.He can now use his 5-stone Psi-Armor for free,allowing him to put his remaining stones into Close Combat and needing less in Defense.His 5-stone Psi-Armor will continue to exist without him adding more stones to it until the combat is done.
Edit:Please leave a comment if you like it or you think of a way I can improve it. #nosmileys#nosmileys#nosmileys#nosmileys#nosmileys#nosmileys
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Post by dolemite on Jul 26, 2003 15:26:51 GMT -5
Sounds good. But I don't really understand the Close Combat part: If have Psi-Armor AN 5 and put 5 stones in it, I can use it for defense and attack once with those stones?
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Post by psistrike on Jul 26, 2003 15:44:12 GMT -5
Sounds good. But I don't really understand the Close Combat part: If have Psi-Armor AN 5 and put 5 stones in it, I can use it for defense and attack once with those stones? Once stones are put into this Action you have a Defense bonus equal to the AN you activated and a bonus to Close Combat equal to the AN you activated for the rest of the current fight as free stones in the same way that Psi-Weapon works. I made its Cost Level +6 Levels because of this being better then a Psi-Weapon because of the free stone to Defense after activated. Also I gave it the Close Combat bonus so you wouldn't have to purchase both Psi-Armor and Psi-Weapon.If it makes you feel better then think of the Close Combat bonus as coming from a Psi-Weapon which is linked to the armor like a sword,axe,or mace.
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Post by bootmobile on Jul 26, 2003 17:42:06 GMT -5
As requested here are my thoughts (remember you asked for it ;D): First, I think I really get what you're going for here. Reminds me of the Unuscione and a power from one of the Palladium superpower books. Second, I like the idea and you have followed the psi-weapon template well. There is the problem that I don't much like the way psi-weapon works (seems open to abuse to me) but I like this better than psi-weapon I think. Mostly I like it better because it is next to impossible to get it at a higher number than 4 or, maybe, 5. (For me nearly of modifiers to Actions or defense breakdown balance-wise after 4.) I thought I would mention that the only other actions that I can think of that add to abilities are growth and shrinking and both have maximums of 6 for Strength. Just a thought. The one thing that really bothers me about this action is that a player could put everything into this one power, having it act as his defense, attack, strength, and other stats. However the huge cost seems to make this extremely difficult so that's good. I think I'll try messing around with the numbers and see what I can do and let you know here. For now I think I'll do some comparisons to give this ability some perspective for myself, I'll be learning as I go. Comparing a Psi-Armour 4 (Case #1) with having Psi-Sword 4 and Psi-Weapon 4 (Case #2). In Case #1 it costs him 15w to get the power and during play he needs to put 4 energy into it once for a +4 modifier to attack and defense. He needs 10 lines to improve the number by 1. In Case #2 it costs him 12w to get the 2 powers and during play he needs to put 8 energy into them once to get a +4 modifier to attack and defense. He needs 20 lines to improve the number of both by 1. I have to say this doesn't look good for your power. For the mere cost of 3w stones you get double the effect for your stones and your power advances twice as fast. The thing that is most glaring to me is that 4 energy is easy to pay and most characters will still be able to defend themselves while paying it. And the other hand 8 is much harder to come up with and many characters are going to be entirely exhausting their reserves to be able to defend themselves at the same time. This makes it look like it would be better to make the Cost Level = AN +7 Levels. That way the spread for having a 4 is 8 more than the two separate powers. Hears a quick look at what happens if the ANs are 5 instead of four. Costs of 20w for armour vs. 18w for the sword and shield. Requires 5 energy to fuel for armour (still a manageable amount) vs. 10 for the sword and shield (A huge amount). It seems the higher the AN the more pronounced the issues I mentioned become. I'm going to look comparing this to having claws 4 and toughness 4 (nullifying AP and 2x from firearms & projectiles). We already know what the armour costs (15w), the claws and toughness cost 21w. If you were to raise the cost of the armour as I suggested the 4 would cost 20w. If we keep your original cost level for this power and make it a modifier (+2 levels) and compare it at AN 4 to claws and toughness 4 again we get the armour modifier costing 25w and the claws/toughness still at 21W. If we raise the cost by 1 as I suggested above, we get a cost of 30w for the modifier armour, which is clearly too much. So it seems that +6 is the most correct pricing but it makes this power maybe too much better than psi-weapon. Then again it is so expensive that I doubt there will be many problems with a lot of people taking it. I'll tell you this just shows again, in my mind, that the current mechanics of Psi-Weapon just don't work. I do have two alternate ways of working it. Each I think works better. HINT: If you ask me to, I'll tell you how I deal with it. (Maybe I'll just make a thread for them, I don't know.) I know that was a lot of information for you to hear that it seems mostly ok to me but I think the voyage yielded some useful analysis. If you disagree well I guess I just wasted a bunch of your time. ;D I still think I'll do some quick number crunching on what can be done with the stat-boosting aspect of the power and post the character I make using this. Hope this was helpful.
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Post by bootmobile on Jul 26, 2003 18:06:53 GMT -5
Here is a quick character I wipped up to see what kind of abuse I could do with the Psi-Armour.
Int: 2 Str: 2 Agi: 2 Spd: 4 [7 w/armour]* Dur: 5 *Use speed to determine order of actions.
Close Combat: 1 (Speed bonus)
Social Skills: 1
Psi-Armour: 6 ~Adds to Speed ~Energy Defense Modifier [+3] ~Mental Defense Modifier [+3]
Requires 6w of challenges.
It's no sooo bad and I was trying to be abusive. You could manage a 9 attack and defense each panel for 15 straight panels though, which is a little extreme.
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Post by psistrike on Jul 26, 2003 18:46:08 GMT -5
One question on that example character.Did you purchase the Energy Defense and Mental Defense Modifier seperately from the Psi-Armor but with the -1 CL disadvantage Only active when Psi-Armor is active or did you buy them as Options for the Psi-Armor directly?
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Post by bootmobile on Jul 26, 2003 20:23:27 GMT -5
Separately with the -1 CL. I was being lazy typing it out.
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Post by psistrike on Jul 26, 2003 22:28:27 GMT -5
After checking the rule book and your example character I don't think this is such a big deal.Your example character could have instead gotten Claws +6 without the Retractable Options,Toughness +6 with the Nullifies Armor Penetration Option(Note:Force Field says that the Armor Penetration Modifier has no effect on a Force Field but doesn't not say that it nullifies 2x Damage from Firearms or Projectiles like the Option for Toughness allows you to.),and Speed increase to 7 all for only 4 white stones more in character creation. The reason the Psi-Armor would cost less by a small amount is because the Psi-Armor is not always active or useable like the normal Modifiers and Abilities would be, which is not very useful if your ambushed.Also you have to spend Energy to activate it at the beginning of each fight or time you need to use it instead of it always being active like a normal Modifier would be. The effects last throughout a fight but the reason I made this Action was to represent individuals who have a short-lived defense and attack combo(but not as short-lived as a normal Force Field but that gets +1 free stone to Defense per stone put into Defense from it(2 to 1 ratio),can be used to protect or even trap others inside,and can be used for attack also(although the stones aren't double for this))and who wish to represent their power with one Action instead of 2.
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Post by bootmobile on Jul 27, 2003 0:09:03 GMT -5
I'll agree to all that. Like I said it was a long way to go to find out that I think you are fine as far as balance is concerned. Or at least this is as balanced as psi-weapon is. And like I said I get and like the idea. I think you have a keeper here.
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Post by psistrike on Jul 27, 2003 0:22:12 GMT -5
Thank you,I just wanted some feedback from others on what they thought to make sure it was balance for the Cost Level I gave it before I made any characters that have the Actions.You have help out alot.
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Post by i3ullseye on Jul 28, 2003 16:16:42 GMT -5
Inherent Flaw Alert!!!
Looking this over, and discussing Psi-Weapons in general, I think we may need to re-do the fight between Elektra and Psylocke. Why? I think most people misinterpret Psi-Weapons.
Heres the thing......
Psi-Weapon is an ACTION, not a modifier. It is intended (as stated in its rules write0-up) to COMBINE with a combat action for effect. So you combine Psi-Weapon and Close Combat, then you are done. No other actions. You only get 2 actions per turn, and this counts as one of them.
Now yes, the stones remain in a free pool of sorts, but using them is still an action.
So no attack and defend. No attack and move. No attack and fly. Nothing. IF you use the Psi Weapons, you MUST combine them with another action or ability that generates the actual attack you want. Then you are done. It is VERY self limiting.
So all things considered that wpould make Psi-Armor GREAT for a completely defensive character. But it should still have the inherent limitation that it MUST combine with another action or ability. It actually makes an armor version of this MORE effective than the attack.
So when you figure Psylocke can ONLY attack on a round she uses her Psi-Weapon, (no maneuverability, not defense, no nothing) Elektra should hand her a defeat rather easily.
To re-cap.
--Psi-Weapon is an ACTION.
--Chargin up the Psi-Weapon counts as one of your 2 actions for that panel.
--Using the stones of Psi-Weapon on following panels counts as one of your actions.
--Psi-Weapon is ONLY effective when combined with another action for the actual attack to be based on.
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Post by psistrike on Jul 28, 2003 16:28:37 GMT -5
Bullseye first on Psi-Armor.It is a Psi-Weapon limited to only Close Combat with a Free Force Field equal to the AN activated when used with some Options added in for flavor text.Calling it Psi-Armor was for flavor and to make it more then just Psi-Weapon with an Option of a Free Force Field equal to AN when used. Also on Psi-Armor it says that stones remain in the Psi-Weapon Action Box and may be reused until combat is over.It doesn't say that it still counts as one on of your 2 Actions for a panel after it is activated or not and the sentence can be misleading on this point even if it is an Action.I have asked Even about this and will post his answer in the General Discussion section once I get it. Until then I won't argue with how other are interpreting it in their games.
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Post by Rushlock on Jul 29, 2003 15:34:05 GMT -5
After reading here and re-reading the book, I think I better undstand Psi-Weapon. I'll post my thoughts here, tell me if I've got it right.
---Stones go into the action, and stay there. ---For as long as combat continues, a character can combine combat with this action for a higher attack. ---If in a panel, a character does not use Psi-Weapon, they can still make 2 other actions. ---Combining Psi-Weapon with a Combat action takes up a character's 2 actions for that panel.
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Post by psistrike on Jul 29, 2003 15:36:42 GMT -5
After reading here and re-reading the book, I think I better undstand Psi-Weapon. I'll post my thoughts here, tell me if I've got it right. ---Stones go into the action, and stay there. ---For as long as combat continues, a character can combine combat with this action for a higher attack. ---If in a panel, a character does not use Psi-Weapon, they can still make 2 other actions. ---Combining Psi-Weapon with a Combat action takes up a character's 2 actions for that panel. I will agree with that when I finally get an answer from Even over on the MURPG Yahoo Group.
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Post by psistrike on Aug 4, 2003 17:00:18 GMT -5
Evan's official answer on Psi-Weapon was this:Yes, it counts like a (weapon) Modifier and you can do 2 other actions. So my Psi-Armor is legal and your interpretations were wrong. So but I have been waiting for this answer for over a week now and had to prove my point.
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