|
Post by WildKnight on Feb 13, 2009 7:10:25 GMT -5
My bad...
"But TWF says its too cheap..." ;D
|
|
|
Post by takewithfood on Feb 13, 2009 8:45:22 GMT -5
We should put a line in somewhere that says that derivative costs don't increase once the game starts. In other words, let's say you have Telepathy with +6 CL of options, and a +2 Modifier - then later if you buy an extra Telepathy option, you don't also have to pay for the cost of your modifier to go up. I hope it works this way, because it's friggin' expensive and awkward otherwise.
EDIT: Also, we're adding in the +1 CL per extra Action it modifiers, right? I assume then we work with the highest cost, and then start adding +1 CLs?
THIS IS GETTING COMPLICATED. lol
~TWF
|
|
|
Post by WildKnight on Feb 13, 2009 12:56:21 GMT -5
Uh... yes, on your second point.
As to the first... I believe that additive costs should ONLY count at character creation OR when you spend XP (LOE), never both. So if you're paying a massive amount for it up front... it shouldn't cost anymore than anything else to increase after the fact.
|
|
|
Post by takewithfood on Feb 13, 2009 13:32:41 GMT -5
Agreed.
~TWF
|
|
|
Post by Neros on Feb 13, 2009 17:58:27 GMT -5
Today, I pointed out to one of my players that we were gona make it so that Ability Bonus's and Modifiers wouldent help beat Difficulty and he brought up a question i couldent answer: How would you find the difficulty then in combat?
|
|
|
Post by Dionon on Feb 13, 2009 18:03:39 GMT -5
I've always maintained that Combat is a series of situational modifiers... There is no difficulty...
|
|
|
Post by takewithfood on Feb 13, 2009 18:10:48 GMT -5
Yeah, there really isn't difficulty in Close Combat - that's sort of what Defense is for.
Breaking a door down has a difficulty. Picking a lock, writing a compelling speech, etc..
~TWF
|
|
|
Post by vjcsmoke on Feb 13, 2009 21:40:46 GMT -5
Ok here is my proposal. Just base it on the 5 tier system. We're already classifying the powers according to 5 tiers so it will be easy to distinguish what actions will be in what tier.
Tier 1. MN+2 Tier 2. MN+3 Tier 3. MN+4 Tier 4. MN+5 Tier 5. MN+6
Additional rules:
1. You cannot get more free stones from your custom modifier than you actively put into the action. Note: I've suggested the same rule for weapons, and I like it in this case too so as to LIMIT the number of free stones.
2. Your modifier may be no higher than half your AN rounded down. Note: Again this serves to limit free stones.
|
|
|
Post by Dionon on Feb 13, 2009 21:41:59 GMT -5
Why are you charging Thor more than Punisher?
Sorry dude, no flying from me on this one.
|
|
|
Post by vjcsmoke on Feb 13, 2009 22:22:17 GMT -5
Why are you charging Thor more than Punisher? Sorry dude, no flying from me on this one. If Thor is using a Tier 4 power, which is more powerful. Than it's going to cost more. If he's using a Tier 2 power, which is less powerful, it's going to cost the same. This is not based on the character's Tier, it's based on the tier of his power. Perhaps a chart would help you understand. Tier 1. Epsilon/Delta Tier 2. Gamma Tier 3. Beta Tier 4. Alpha Tier 5. Omega So let's say Magneto's mastery of Magnetism is a Tier 5 power. IF he wants a custom modifier for Mastery of Magnetism which he has at an AN of 9, the cost for his custome modifier would be MN+6 and the modifier itself cannot exceed half his AN so it would be a maximum of +4. Likewise we can calculate the Tier of powers by their CL or options. For example if you have Telepathy with all the options, that's automatically a tier 5 power. And work your way downwards from there.
|
|
|
Post by Dionon on Feb 13, 2009 22:31:33 GMT -5
We kinda did away with those.... At least as far as I know... I thought you meant charge more per Magnitude... sorry.
|
|
|
Post by vjcsmoke on Feb 13, 2009 22:41:19 GMT -5
Ok let me phrase custom modifiers another way if Dionon's way of classifying/costing powers into separate categories has been scrapped.
Tier 1. MN+2 Tier 2. MN+3 Tier 3. MN+4 Tier 4. MN+5 Tier 5. MN+6
Tier 1. 2 max options advantages Tier 2. 4 max options advantages Tier 3. 6 max options advantages Tier 4. 8 max options advantages Tier 5. 10+ options/advantages
With the limitations described as follows:
1. You cannot get more free stones from your custom modifier than you actively put into the action. Note: I've suggested the same rule for weapons, and I like it in this case too so as to LIMIT the number of free stones.
2. Your modifier may be no higher than half your AN rounded down. Note: Again this serves to limit free stones.
3. You may increase your modifier by lines so long as you don't violate rule 2. The cost is as follows:
Tier 1. 20 LOE Tier 2. 30 LOE Tier 3. 40 LOE Tier 4. 50 LOE Tier 5. 60 LOE
|
|
|
Post by takewithfood on Feb 13, 2009 23:00:30 GMT -5
I'd like to stay away from more tiers.. maybe that's just me, but I find them kinda awkward.
I'm 100% behind #1.
I'm iffy about #2, but at the very least it's a good guideline. I'm just not sure if it should be a hard rule.
I can't really get behind #3. I think Modifiers should be bought just like Actions. I don't think they're inherently more valuable and thus they shouldn't be more expensive. I think the reason you couldn't buy up Modifiers with LOEs is that many of them represent things that are static and can't really "get better". Wolverine's claws don't get any bigger or sharper as he gets more experienced, for example. Making it more expensive for them to do so doesn't address that issue.
Which Modifiers can and can't increase should be decided at character creation and agreed upon by GM and player, just like anything else on the CAD. The decision should be based on a relative amount of logic and backed by sound balance.
~TWF
|
|
|
Post by Dionon on Feb 13, 2009 23:03:21 GMT -5
Well... I'm against all three personally.... Limiting the creative freedom of players is not what we're here for... You'll have to prove to me that they are balanced and non-confining before I agree.
|
|
|
Post by vjcsmoke on Feb 13, 2009 23:05:45 GMT -5
Well... I'm against all three personally.... Limiting the creative freedom of players is not what we're here for... You'll have to prove to me that they are balanced and non-confining before I agree. They are balanced. Otherwise you get the Close Combat 1, Combat Prowess 9 generic modifier guy. I spend 1 stone into my close combat and get a 10 stone attack. POW!!! How is that balanced? And how does it limit anyone's creativity to say - If you want to have a modifier make you really good at something you have to A) Invest stones of effort and B) Actually be pretty skilled at the thing you want to buff up?
|
|