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Post by Dionon on Feb 22, 2009 21:33:14 GMT -5
Hey... what's wrong with breaking Masteries down into core components and then having a mechanic for the ONLY thing in a mastery that needs a separate mechanic?
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Post by WildKnight on Feb 22, 2009 21:41:14 GMT -5
"Wrong" is a flexible word, in this case.
I don't think theres anything that makes it inherently a bad rule, I just don't like it as much as having Masteries as grouped powers, just like Black Ops is a grouped skill.
In other words, its primarily a personal preference issue. But there will be those for whom its more; by making Masteries into separate actions, you make people with a lot of powers related to one power (like Magneto, for instance) pay a TREMENDOUS amount of stones to get all of their powers, when they used to be able to get a big chunk of them fairly cheap because of the grouped cost of a Mastery.
However, I have no problem with the fact that someone like Magneto should cost a tremendous number of stones to construct.
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Post by Dionon on Feb 22, 2009 21:49:56 GMT -5
Hmmm.... I wonder.... You know what? I'll make some of the CADs using my system of old Marvel People....
Let's see...
Magneto Johnny Storm -and- Storm
I want to see exactly how many stones they come out to be.
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Post by Dionon on Feb 22, 2009 22:02:24 GMT -5
Magneto's up first... Granted... I used the 1.0 rules for everything, so that's just a warning... For Reference, Magneto's Mastery, as written is 45 stones... Broken down into core components... it's 42
Magneto Name: Maxwell Ernheart/Eric Magnus Lensheer Height: 6'2" Weight: 190lbs Hair: Bluish-Grey Eyes: Silver Species: Mutant
Int: 8 (i) (18) Str: 1 (1r) Agi: 2 (2r) Spd: 2 (2r) Dur: 2 (2)
Close Combat: 5 (3) Ranged Combat: 3 (1) Statecraft: 5 (4) Telepathy: 1 (2r) Magnetic Telekinesis: 9 (20) - Bought with Teplepathy (-1) - May only be used on Ferrous Objects or Self (-2) - Accumulate Energy over time (+2) Force Field: 9 (12) - Bought with Telekinesis (-1) - 1/2 Defense against Non Ferrous Materials (-1) Genetic Engineering: 7 (30) Technology: 7 (9) Flight: 8 (12) - Condussive with Main Power (-1)
MODIFIERS Mental Defense +2 (2r) Wealth +8 (9) Immunity to Magnetic Force (10 stones)
TOTAL: 133 Stones OLD Total: 136 Stones
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Post by WildKnight on Feb 22, 2009 22:06:56 GMT -5
No, its 47.
Theres no way in HELL Magneto's "telekinesis" qualifies for "bought with Telepathy" as its in no way shape or form a psychic power.
You're also missing his Force Blast completely, and nothing on your CAD accounts for his ability to reshape metal at a molecular level, or build machines out of random objects (oh, and Magneto is NOT limited to ferrous objects in what he can lift/move... and hasn't been since before any of here was born...)
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Post by Dionon on Feb 22, 2009 22:10:51 GMT -5
Next up, The Human Torch (Here you go Kaim... it's a difference of 8 stones)
Human Torch Name: Johnny Storm Height: 5'10" Weight: 170lbs Hair: Blond Eyes: Blue Species: Mutagetic
Int: 3/3 (1w, 2r) Str: 2/2 (1) Agi: 2/2 (1) Spd: 2/2 (1) Dur: 3/3 (4w, 1r)
Close Combat: 4 (2) Technology: 5 (4) Vehicles: 5 (3) Social Skills: 3 (1) Force Blast: 0/7 (12) - 2x Damage (+2) - Causes Collateral Damage (-1) - Overstrain (Special Hours version) (+1) Create/Manipulate Fire: 7 (12) Flight: 0/5 (4) - 1 stone to carry others without burning them (-1)
MODIFIERS Toughness +0/+3 (4) Immunity to Fire/Heat (10)
OLD MASTERY COST: 30 stones NEW MASTERY COST: 38 stones (Increase in Immunity Cost)
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Post by Dionon on Feb 22, 2009 22:11:49 GMT -5
No, its 47. Theres no way in HELL Magneto's "telekinesis" qualifies for "bought with Telepathy" as its in no way shape or form a psychic power. You're also missing his Force Blast completely, and nothing on your CAD accounts for his ability to reshape metal at a molecular level, or build machines out of random objects (oh, and Magneto is NOT limited to ferrous objects in what he can lift/move... and hasn't been since before any of here was born...) If it wasn't listed on his CAD I didn't include it... Let the player take THAT up with the GM.
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Post by malice on Feb 22, 2009 22:17:26 GMT -5
I would've given Torch the fire immunity for 6, maybe 8 stones. 10 is a bastard GM (or a cautious presenter )
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Post by Dionon on Feb 22, 2009 22:17:44 GMT -5
Storm Name: Ororo Munroe Height: 5'11" Weight: 159lbs Hair: White Eyes: Blue Species: Mutant
Int: 4 (2) Str: 2 (2r) Agi: 2 (2r) Spd: 2 (2r) Dur: 3 (3)
Close Combat 5 (3) Ranged Combat 5 (3) Social Skills 4 (2) Leadership 6 (4) Thieving 4 (2) Flight 5 (4) - Condussive with Main Power (-1) Create/Manipulate Weather 7 (20) - Accumulate Energy (+2) Force Blast 7 (12) - 2x Damage (+2)
MODIFIERS Immunity to the Destructive Powers of Ororo Munroe (3 stones) Wealth +1
OLD MASTERY COST: 25 stones NEW MASTERY COST: 32 stones
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Post by Dionon on Feb 22, 2009 22:18:21 GMT -5
Well, there you have it folks... 3 of the core Masters of Marvel done out with my system... Not to shabby...
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Post by Dionon on Feb 22, 2009 22:19:38 GMT -5
I would've given Torch the fire immunity for 6, maybe 8 stones. 10 is a bastard GM (or a cautious presenter ) Actually if done by the House Rules system, I think it's 10 stones for Fire for the frequency you find Fire in comics. AND... I've dealt with bastard GMs before lol, and always present CADs as if I were going to be yelled at.
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Post by malice on Feb 22, 2009 22:22:30 GMT -5
Ok, so Torch and Storm paid MORE for their masteries with your system, but Magneto's (Who's still stuck with 1 strength, rofl) got 3 stones cheaper.
It's possible your system introduces an averaging effect where lower-powered Masteries are more expensive and higher-powered ones get cheaper after 100 stones.
It's not looking good...
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Post by malice on Feb 22, 2009 22:24:51 GMT -5
I would've given Torch the fire immunity for 6, maybe 8 stones. 10 is a bastard GM (or a cautious presenter ) Actually if done by the House Rules system, I think it's 10 stones for Fire for the frequency you find Fire in comics. AND... I've dealt with bastard GMs before lol, and always present CADs as if I were going to be yelled at. To hell with THAT system then. Forcing a player to pay half an invulnerability's cost when it's already a slap in the face to buy a partial invulnerability is just a mean bastard of a GM. That being said, I probably would've presented a similarly expensive version to pre-emptively avoid some criticism.
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Post by Dionon on Feb 22, 2009 22:32:52 GMT -5
Well... Technically WK's pitching a fit that I allowed Magneto's Telekinesis to fall under the "Bought with Telepathy" thing. Honestly... I'd say that's the only reason he has Telepathy on his CAD... he doesn't use it, and honestly it's just a flavor thing that if he would just get over his childhood trauma, he'd BE a Telepath.
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Post by malice on Feb 23, 2009 0:21:17 GMT -5
I've taken telepathy 1 for the discount on TK
I've taken TK 1 for the discount on Force Field
I'm not ashamed.
TK 1 is actually a lot of fun. It's practically a flavor action at that level.
"DUDE the wind just blew that girl's skirt up!"
"What?!? We're indoors!"
"It's stayin' up!"
Telepathy 1 isn't bad either, cuz you can't overcome ANYONE'S mental defense, but they know when you try and just look at you like you're stupid.
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