|
Post by WildKnight on Jun 16, 2011 18:39:36 GMT -5
D&D is very odd. Everybody complains about how OP the magic is, how unbalanced the classes are, etc (and in large part, they're right)... but it's still the best RPG out there. Well, discounting 4th Edition of course. D&D is a victim of its own success. Every system I've ever played is just as flawed. D&D just has the distinction of being the one with the most people who are familiar with it, and therefore the most people to complain
|
|
preach901
Puny Human
College ruined my brain.
Posts: 18
|
Post by preach901 on Jun 17, 2011 17:50:02 GMT -5
that's very true. I myself had no problems with the system, just kind of got bored of it. Although, while 3.5 is my fav. version I can say it is not newb friendly. some of the rules just make players give me that blank stare like "what?" lol.
|
|
|
Post by honestiago on Jun 17, 2011 17:59:42 GMT -5
"5 foot step"
That sums up 3.5 for me. I'll admit there's a rule to cover everything. Which is why I no longer play it. Wk is right about one thing, though -- every system has flaws. For what 3.5 does, it's very good (and I'll admit it's a huge improvement over everything that came before). But I'm a rules light guy these days, so I shy away from it.
|
|
|
Post by Manah on Jun 19, 2011 20:53:14 GMT -5
D&D is very odd. Everybody complains about how OP the magic is, how unbalanced the classes are, etc (and in large part, they're right)... but it's still the best RPG out there. Well, discounting 4th Edition of course. D&D is a victim of its own success. Every system I've ever played is just as flawed. D&D just has the distinction of being the one with the most people who are familiar with it, and therefore the most people to complain Oh, I dunno. For having discovered Anima, I tend to think of D&D as sub-par at best (of course, you don't like Anime, therefore a system inspired by it will drive you nuts, so you'll probably still love D&D more). Anime inspiration aside, however, if you look only at game mechanics, I still prefer Anima over D&D.
|
|
|
Post by WildKnight on Jun 20, 2011 9:06:33 GMT -5
Never heard of Anima, but in my experience systems designed to represent anime, tend to include mechanics for the type of over the top nonsense that makes me hate anime.
I'm still going to stick my flag in the statement that D&D 3.5 was the pinncale of RPG development. NO system will ever make everyone happy, but the amount of complaining about D&D (and the amount of burnout from it) shows just how popular and utilitarian it really was.
Gig, you may like Anima *right now*... but I propose to you that in 10 years, you won't even remember it. It'll just be one of dozens of systems that you've played over the years. D&D 3.5? Will still be the foundation for everything that came after.
|
|
|
Post by Silentking Alpha on Jun 20, 2011 16:44:27 GMT -5
I feel so proud to own the main three core rulebooks of D&D 3.5 right now. Do they still sell other core rulebooks for D&D 3.5? Are there any other core rulebooks for that system?
|
|
|
Post by WildKnight on Jun 20, 2011 16:50:08 GMT -5
PHB II was a really good supplement.
Actually, though, for me 3.5 died the moment Pathfinder came into existence. Pathfinder is like 3.5 for grown ups
|
|
|
Post by Manah on Jun 22, 2011 9:26:04 GMT -5
Gig, you may like Anima *right now*... but I propose to you that in 10 years, you won't even remember it. It'll just be one of dozens of systems that you've played over the years. D&D 3.5? Will still be the foundation for everything that came after. No way, good sir. When I say "I like Anima much more than D&D", I don't mean "Oh, it's rather good among all the other systems I've played." I genuinely compare the two gameplay mechanics, what I like and dislike about both, and come to the conclusion that "Wow, I used to think of D&D as the greatest RPG ever. Surprising, considering how much better that Anima is." Of course, I'll always remember D&D: I played D&D for nearly half of my life. And I would probably play D&D again, depending on the GM and the players, because as far as I'm concerned, it was a good system. However, I won't forget Anima, because I intend to play at least for as long if not longer and it is far better IMO than D&D ever will be no matter how many dozens more editions of it they make. It's true that, like you mentionned; ...and Anima is no exception. But those "over the top nonsense" which you hate (and which us anime-lovers like, so for every single one of us out there, that's actually a plus), are merely "optional rules". You don't like'em, don't use'em. Finally, I will conclude by saying that, as far as I'm concerned, the fact that many people are complaining about D&D only shows that many people have played it because it is more widely known and talked about, and also that there's a lot of things to complain about in it. As far as gameplay mechanics go, you won't hear a lot of people complain about Anima. Mostly because few people know of it, that's true... but also because there are very few flaws other than some translations mistakes that are easy to ignore (original language is spanish). So, that's just my 2 cents. I just disagree with the proverbial "D&D is king of the hill because it's either the best RPG out there or because more people are playing it". But, since I just wanted to express my opinion and don't want to argue (especially not against a master argue-er like you ), I'll leave it at that. Or heck, I'll finish that on a little humorous note. You know, Wk, I'm sure if you tried Anima while ignoring the Anime-inspired optional rules and Ki-system, you'd like it. ...umm... well... Actually you'd probably hate it if only because it was inspired by anime wether it is good or not. ;D
|
|
|
Post by WildKnight on Jun 22, 2011 9:54:10 GMT -5
Ah yes, the old "everyone knows about it because everyone knows about it" argument.
|
|
|
Post by Manah on Jun 22, 2011 10:29:32 GMT -5
That's not what I meant and you know it, Dr. Grumpy (not an insult, by the way: I am, in fact, a fan of your sarcastic comments). D&D is older, and Wizards of the Cost is a huge, wealthy company. It ensured its product success as soon as it became somewhat popular through marketing. Therefore it's more widely known. ;D Anima is made by a single guy (writing the books and making the rules, I mean). OBVIOUSLY it will never be as widely known as D&D, because the guy doesn't have the ressources to make it so. As usual, WK, think what you will. And I'll do the same. But we'll have to agree to disagree. ^_^
|
|
|
Post by WildKnight on Jun 22, 2011 19:08:39 GMT -5
There's a massive hole in your logic. Pathfinder, which is put together by a much smaller company than Wizards of the Coast, is currently crushing Dungeons & Dragons 4th Edition. By making updated 3.5 product.
|
|
|
Post by honestiago on Jun 22, 2011 20:25:27 GMT -5
I think gig's point is there are more opinions on D&D because more people have played it. Familiarity breeds more opinions, to include more negative ones. As far as it being the best rules ever, well, if you like having a rule for everything, nothing satisfies like 3.5 and it's follow up, pathfinder. It's nirvana for the anal retentive (5-foot step, tumble, activate Feat). It's so packed with options, in fact, that I'm sure it could mimic Anime really well.
|
|
|
Post by WildKnight on Jun 22, 2011 20:37:26 GMT -5
Actually, I've found that the primary advantage of 3.5 is flexibility, which is the opposite of "rule for everything."
It's nice being able to do things that are fun without having to argue over whether the goblin can run that far in a round, etc.
That said, "best" is a very flexible term. 3.5 may not be the best set of RPG rules ever, but it is the pinnacle of the hobby. Almost everything that came after it borrows something from it, despite the absolute denial of the proponents of those systems.
|
|
|
Post by honestiago on Jun 22, 2011 20:51:05 GMT -5
Not sure it's accurate to call something flexible is there's a rule for everything. The more apt term is comprehensive, which it is. But it can be cumbersome, as well. The upside is, you can't argue rules interpretation in there's a rule for everything. Certainly everything that came after borrows. If all you have is a list of attributes, you're borrowing from D&D. I'm rather surprised Pathfinder is outselling 4th ed, but if it is, serves WotC right for using MMO sensibilities.
|
|
|
Post by honestiago on Jun 22, 2011 20:54:02 GMT -5
By the way, I run a very rules light campaign IRL, and we have no rules arguments at all. We DO have lots of folks bashing each other for 'stupid' game decisions, but I think that's unavoidable.
|
|