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Post by takewithfood on Oct 6, 2011 17:09:42 GMT -5
You can't expect people to live on only Wonder Woman, and ignore the majority of the remaining female characters who are softcore porn first, characters second.
EDIT: For clarity, I'm not agreeing with this sentiment so much as trying to explain my understanding of it. I haven't read the comics and don't plan to, so I have no opinion of my own.
~TWF
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Post by WildKnight on Oct 6, 2011 17:13:21 GMT -5
You can't expect people to live on only Wonder Woman, and ignore the majority of the remaining female characters who are softcore porn first, characters second. ~TWF If that were the case, I'd agree. It's not, though. It's two characters, as far as I've been able to determine, and I've read almost all of the New 52 #1's. Regardless, what I can do is expect people to be intellectually honest about the fact that most of these things they're upset about were the case before the reboot, and have nothing to do with how "accessible" the titles are.
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Post by takewithfood on Oct 6, 2011 17:23:18 GMT -5
I haven't gotten to impression that the people who are upset are upset only about these comics, nor have I seen anyone say so. I think you're right (and that they would probably agree with you) that they're already fatigued from the continuing portrayal of women in comics.
~TWF
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Post by roxolid on Oct 6, 2011 18:32:24 GMT -5
I think it's a shame that the reboot will be remembered for the wrong reasons with certain titles but I recently read some early Teen Titans comics and Starfire has, it seems, always chased 'Dick' (though the term takes on a different meaning with the reboot and no Robin/Nightwing in sight). Missed opportunity to do something decent with the reboot/character or grabbing headlines/interest from frothing at the mouth fanboys who are outraged/intrigued by the characters' promiscuity? Time (and sales figures) will tell. I predict that there may be a backlash from fans who drop the book like a hot potato and there'll be a rethink/u-turn about the way certain characters (Starfire, Green Lantern, Superman, even) have been rebooted. That's only my opinion though, and I've been wrong before
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Post by WildKnight on Oct 6, 2011 20:12:12 GMT -5
Out of curiosity, why did you not like Green Lantern? Or if you liked it, why do you think others don't/won't?
I was a fan of the pre-rebirth Hal Jordan (the "good soldier with very little personality"), but ever since Rebirth, he's been established to be pretty much exactly the way the reboot has shown him (for my money, anyway), and a lot of people seem to think of Rebirth as one of the better Hal Jordan stories.
That said, I do agree with you that there will be a lot of "fine tuning" with some of these reboot personas.
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Post by roxolid on Oct 7, 2011 1:50:37 GMT -5
I've only seen him in JL #1, and he seemed to be a bit of an idiot. That said, I watched the film recently and Ryan Reynolds more or less played him that way, so I can see what DC have done. And the new Superman movie, costume change etc... Looks like Warner Bros (DC parent) wants a 'tie-in' across the range - Comics, Films, Merchandise etc. Good business strategy but for the die hard fans who buy the stuff regardless of whether an (at best) average movie comes out, there's a giant collective "WTF?!?!?" usually. Maybe we should have a sweepstake/take friendly bets on what gets canned/changed/tweaked first
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Post by shenron on Oct 7, 2011 3:50:20 GMT -5
Well, I just finished Action Comics #1 and #2 and I have to say I am impressed. I have never been a big Superman fan - Don't get me wrong I love the concept but I was always disappointing in the execution. I enjoyed the fresh take on Clark Kent who is a poor internet blogger/newspaper article writer who lives in the bad part of town and does not work for the Daily Planet. I also enjoyed how Superman was portrayed. He did not seem douchy at all and displayed flaws and a sense of humor. Plus, I liked how he is he does not seem how do I put it... I think I might actually highly enjoy reading Superman for the first time in longer then I remember.
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Post by WildKnight on Oct 7, 2011 6:01:33 GMT -5
Superman not douchy at all? The fact that he attacks police officers for the simple fact that he doesn't like their politics strikes you as heroic, then?
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Post by Silentking Alpha on Oct 7, 2011 7:48:01 GMT -5
Shenron probably doesn't like the police.
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Post by WildKnight on Oct 7, 2011 8:35:36 GMT -5
I don't necessarily like the police, either, particularly if they seem corrupt, but that doesn't give me the right to go around attacking them. Batman, oddly enough, actually seems to care about not hurting or getting hurt the police of Gotham, whereas this sorry-ass excuse for a Superman is openly attacking authority figures. It's back-asswards day at the DC Universe.
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Post by takewithfood on Oct 7, 2011 8:44:04 GMT -5
Well, the writers are in a difficult position: either they write the characters basically as they were, which sort of defeats the purpose of doing a reboot, or they write the characters as being very different from the way they used to be, which sort of defeats the purpose about writing about those characters.
This is why I don't like reboots unless the source material was badly, badly bungled.
~TWF
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Post by roxolid on Oct 7, 2011 9:05:35 GMT -5
Plus the fact that whatever happens with this reboot will all be retconned/forgotten/rebooted out of existence in a year, two years, whatever.
None of this will ever have happened.
That's one of the reasons I won't get too worked up about whatever rubbish is going on in comics (The Beyonder, All manner of spider related nonsense, Crisis on Infinite Earths with multiple character deaths - except they don't stay dead, Civil War, etc. Say, is Bill Foster back from the dead yet? He's been dead long enough by now *checks watch*). Another is cost. I buy comics for my youngster, albeit ones I have to check first for content appropriate to 8 year olds, and £10 will just about get 4-5 comics, depending on the title.
No wonder comic sales are dropping - no one has any money to spend on books they don't care about because whatever they read about this year will simply not have ever happened in 12 months or so time...
After saying all that though, a well drawn/inked book will sucker me into buying it regardless of the babble in the speech balloons. I loves me some Alan Davis, John Byrne, George Perez, a whole host of others that I need reminding of but would recognise instantly, visually...*sigh*
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Post by roxolid on Oct 7, 2011 9:16:56 GMT -5
I think the main thing this reboot brings about is the Stormwatch characters being brought into the DC fold. I'm a bit disappointed not to see any brand new, never seen before characters though. Have I missed any? More importantly, why don't we see many new superheroes these days? Have all the best stories been told already? Have the best characters been created?
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Post by WildKnight on Oct 7, 2011 9:40:32 GMT -5
Creating new heroes is a major risk. Take a look at the Image titles. At launch, they sold tons and tons of copies, had action figures, etc... now they're all persona non grata in the comic book world. As popular as Spawn once was, Batman will always come out on top over any "updated" ripoff.
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Post by roxolid on Oct 7, 2011 10:15:04 GMT -5
You have a point, but the fact that Spawn was so breakout/big for a time proves it's worth trying out new characters to see if you'll 'hit gold'. I never read a Spawn comic but it was hard to miss the figures, merchandise etc, and of course the film, which probably about 14 people went to see. I'm pretty sure Todd McFarlane would be pretty pleased he came up with the character *ker-ching*
Another example, Teenage Turtles. For sure they are nowhere now but for a time they were the 'big thing' with revenues that had Marvel and DC looking on in envy with all the toys and junk that was sold, cartoon shows and so on.
They might be no longer here, at least in the size they were, but for a while they really do rake in the cash, I suspect, so its always worth punting something new out to see if it catches on...
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