Thoughts About Magic

[Neros]

One of my players wanted to play a Magician and he bought Mastery of Magic and Sorcery...

1. In the description, Mastery of Magic can more or less do the same effects as Sorcery (create holes in the ground as the example)... Can you manipulate reality with Mastery of Magic?

2. He also asked if he could make Blasts and Barriers with Sorcery... But im not sure i should allow him to, cause then it would take a good deal away from Mastery of magic...

3. What would you include as "Do'able" with Sorcery?

4. When defending against Magic, is it really only Ability + Magical Defense that needs to be overcome?? Seems like it makes some things more useless than others.... What about Magical Blasts?? Would that be defense or just Magical Defense??

[Jet]

Magic is a tough thing to explain, so as a GM, you should use common sense more than the rules in the book.

1. If you read carefully the description of Mastery of magic, you will find one thing that will answer that question: The following actions/modifiers are not included in <magic actions names> unless specified. And hex-spheres is among them, and thats the way to change reality, so the answer is no - you cant change the reality with it, at least not with Mastery of Magic. Witchcraft however, has this option in description so it allows it.

2. Sorcery involves cooperation between GM and player, so its up to you. If you think its fair for him to shoot blasts with sorcery, you may allow him. But then again, Sorcery is to versatile and cheap, that you should use common sense in making situational modifiers. Sorcery is supposed to do everything, while Mastery of Magic is more battle oriented (with magical blasts), so at discretion, give him a -1 or -2 if you think he's abusing the system. You are the ruler here, and Situational Modifers are your best weapon that nodoby can fight with (though if overused, they wont be pleased, but then again- nobody said being a GM is easy).

3. Sorcery can do about anything, so I guess it can DO anything. The question is- will GM allow it? Magic is a tricky power- we see Doctor Strange doing really weird stuff, but then again, sometimes even sorcery cant help him with some problems (the reason he was in Defenders). My solution (think of: If I was a GM, I would do that) would be to limit Sorcery to the role of "Inteligence". Sure, if you have inteligence you can do many things- it allows you to drive a car, to hack a computer, to give orders, to think of better solutions. Bit inteligence alone cant do much, so thats why actions like Vehicle Operation, Technology, Leadership and Concentration were born- to be more specific. Lets say you want to make a zombie with sorcery. It wouldnt be fair to make it as powerfull as Necromancy, since its a skill oriented with making a zombie. As such, Sorcery can do it, but with lesser effect (situational modifier "use action without proper specialty").

4. That depends "what kind of magic is that". You can use about any element in magic attack, such as fire, ice and even gravity- if thats the case, you can treat it like "Magical + Elemental", and the defense would be:
Magical Defence (for Magical effect) + Elemental Defence (like Fire defense from armor or such). Keep In mind, that if someone is immune to fire, if you make a magical fireball it wont hurt him, becouse... he's immune to fire, and thats the main theme. But if he's immune to magic, than the damage will be decreased, but the opponent can still be burned, at some point. Or you could think, that no matter what origins the fireball is, it still is a fireball in the end, and magical defence wont have anything to say, but other modifiers (like Toughness and reflexive dodge) will work. Your call here, Im only suggesting.
But it the attack is strictly magical (like Dr Strange's favourite beams and blasts), than you should use magical defense + stones in defense. Abbility only applies when the specific effect requires it (like putting to Sleep or poison), but not when making a blast.
Again, use the common sense- if Captain America fought against Mordo, would he be able to endure his beams? He doesnt have any Magical Defense, and Toughness and costume shouldnt work on that attack, but I bet he still could survive using his willpower (stones of effort in defense, but not inteligence or mental defense modifiers!).

Common sense, again, common sense. There's no other way to think about using Sorcery without it.

[Neros]

Hehe... Im all for using common sense, and it is tricky... But i havent played with magic before (and neither have my players), so i would rather ask if someone all ready had a Fix for it...

1. You can... Well, if you follow the description... They give an example where Dr. Strange creates a hole under a couple of Goons... Im pretty sure thats altering reallity, since the earth and pavement simply disappears...
Also, Sorcery has also a example where you create a path through a mountain and turn stuff into something els...

2. Mastery of Magic isent really battle oriented... Takes a panel to prepare ... So its not really that practical for combat... Which is one of the reasons ive thought about removing "Takes a panel to prepare", but im kinda thinking that its the reason the other actions are so cheap...

3. I know its a tricky power, and its not only about common sense, its also about balance, it is after all only a +2 action...

4. The problem with letting reflexive dodge and Toughness work, is that No effect in mastery of magic is allowed to exceed 6... And a character has to pay for every aspect of the effect... Duration, Range, Area Effect, Damage...
So if a character just has 2-3 in Automatic Defense (and places some stones from something els), nothing will really happen... And when creating magical blasts (as i see it), you dont create a pure version of and element... Fex, you wont get 2xDamage from fire...

[thanos]

1. In the description, Mastery of Magic can more or less do the same effects as Sorcery (create holes in the ground as the example)... Can you manipulate reality with Mastery of Magic?
-->Mastery of Magic is severely limited to to descriptions given under it. The example of making a hole in the ground is a 'Minor Effect of Manipulation of Magic'. Barriers, a Magic Blast, and Illusions round out the rest of those abilities...just like described in the main book. 6 stones to pay for effect, range, and duration is not a lot, so this is a rather limited action, IMHO. What it allows you to learn is why it is useful.


2. He also asked if he could make Blasts and Barriers with Sorcery... But im not sure i should allow him to, cause then it would take a good deal away from Mastery of magic...
-->Blasts, sure, but he has to pay for the Range as Sorcery doesn't specify that its like Force Blast which has a range of 4. Barriers, yes, but AoE greater than personal is also something that needs to be paid for as MoM specifies it is like FF (which allows protection up to area 2 at no extra cost) and Sorcery doesn't.

3. What would you include as "Do'able" with Sorcery?
-->Anything that doesn't break the game, can be given some justification, and is paid for by the character. Anything that lasts longer than 1 Panel/Instant is going to have a cost (such as a Barrier), as will the Area of Effect/Range. If you add both of those on top of the stones of effect it really starts adding up. An Area 2 (10'), Duration 2 (10 panels), Barrier of Stone 8, to keep the badguys from following you down the tunnel, would cost 12 stones total. That is about as much as a 40 stone magician is going to have in total Energy and he would have to have a 6 in Sorcery with the Int modifier (Int 6i) to go along with that. Total cost CG would be 41 stones to pull that one off.

4. When defending against Magic, is it really only Ability + Magical Defense that needs to be overcome?? Seems like it makes some things more useless than others.... What about Magical Blasts?? Would that be defense or just Magical Defense??
-->It depends on if it is a direct magical effect like turning them into a Toad or if it is indirect, such as having a meteor fall on them. In the case of turning them into a Toad, Magic Defense applies where as Toughness/Reflexive Dodge/Defense does not. The Meteor on the other hand is just a hot falling rock and Toughness/Defense/Etc does apply. Remember turning somebody into a toad just for 1 hour requires they be close by (or pay for range), 3 stones of duration, and overcoming their (Durability or Intelligence your choice) + Magical Resistance.



Sorcery is very FLEXIBLE and VERSATILE. It is not, however, all powerful as some people make it out to be. To get the massive effects you have to pay a massive amount of stones. By itself Sorcery is cool, but not overpowering. You have to watch out when you see your players taking Accumulate Energy, Increase Action # Modifier, Summoning, Psycho-Centric Power Template, and perhaps Biocomputing. These additions can give a Magic User the Energy (or modifiers) to cast the really big stuff, but in the end there are forces out there that keep really big stuff that could have unforseen consequences from happening (like the Sorcerer Supreme).

[Neros]

Thanks Thanos... Most of what you just wrote there seems fair...