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Post by Dionon on Aug 5, 2010 21:07:08 GMT -5
Alrighty, that looks good.
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Post by l3eta-00a1x on Aug 6, 2010 6:38:48 GMT -5
After getting a good (bad?) nights sleep, more questions!
Question: Like my previous question, but what if I had used a Generic Modifier to Close Combat? Say one had Claws and the other had Nerve Strike. Would that only be flavor, because there are other uses and advantages for both.
Question 2: What if the Generic Modifier was for different actions? (I'm guessing 'no' in this case, but thought I'd ask)
Question 3: Which of these options work? -Force Blast at 5, +2 for 2X Damage, -3 for Range 1, +1 for combines with CC, total cost 3 -Harmful Touch at 5, +2 for Lethal Damage, total cost 6 -Mastery of Element at 5, Basic Attack with range 1, +1 for combine with CC, total cost 4(?) -Psi Weapon at 5, Only create one weapon type, total cost 9(?) -Generic Modifier at 5, total cost 9 -Immolation at 5, -1 for touch only, total cost 2 These would all make flaming fists to increase Close Combat. I'm not sure whether or not I can add the 'Only in conjunction with CC' disadvantage to these, but if I can consider it on.
Question 4: Is there a way to create equipment that is essentially a normal weapon, but can be 'turned on' so it adds damage specific to an element? Like say a sword that does regular damage, and for all purposes works like any other sword, but than you activate it and you add 2 fire damage whenever it hits.
Question 5: If I had a thrown weapon, and put it on a chain, would I still have to pay for the 'returns to owner' advantage? I could flick it back towards me, but it could be taken away, or get tangled in something.
Question 6: Is there still a limit on Disadvantages? Because some things (like growth) have been upped in cost, while taking away a disadvantage. So could I get Growth at 2 with 'can't be improved' for example?
I think that's it for now. I know the answer to some of these, but would like to make sure that I'm right.
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Post by takewithfood on Aug 6, 2010 7:57:20 GMT -5
Question: Like my previous question, but what if I had used a Generic Modifier to Close Combat? Say one had Claws and the other had Nerve Strike. Would that only be flavor, because there are other uses and advantages for both. Question 2: What if the Generic Modifier was for different actions? (I'm guessing 'no' in this case, but thought I'd ask) I'm starting to wonder what the point of making a transform self character if the two CADs are so similar. ^__^ The point is usually to make two very different forms (eg, Emma Frost's diamond and telepathic forms) or a powered-up version of yourself (Colossus). If you want a character who just has different flavour, it's probably best not to use the transform self ruleset and maybe work on a custom challenge or something. Just going by the phrase "flaming fists", I think you're actually best with a generic modifier. But you could get by with the force blast. Using an entire Mastery just for a bonus to close combat is a bit of a waste (it would be like buying Telepathy just for the mental defense); likewise with Psi Weapon, as it is intended to have other purposes. Immolation is fine, but beware that you'd be getting much more than just flaming fists - allies wouldn't be able to touch you while it was on, nor would you be able to touch them safely; you might also set things on fire by accident. Also be warned that I will only accept a generic modifier as high as 5 in rare circumstances. I try to keep players from relying entirely on modifiers and gobs of free energy, as it makes the game exceedingly boring. This sorta sounds like the x2 damage advantage. There's also a +1 damage advantage, which only costs +1 CL; you simply add 1 point to any damage you deal. That's not one whole white stone, it's just one red, but it can sometimes mean the difference between 1 white of damage and 2; it can also mean longer KO times, etc. A typical big sword would probably have x2 damage even when it isn't on fire, so you could "turn on" x3 damage instead. I wouldn't give a discount for having to turn it on (that's like saying that a gun only deals damage if you pull the trigger) but I'd consider a discount if turning it on made the extra damage fire element (which can be resisted in various ways). If it's a dagger on a chain that you just swing around as a weapon, you basically have a melee weapon with the "reach" advantage (you gain a +1 stone to defense against anyone attacking you in close combat who doesn't also have reach). If you have a weapon that you can throw, then easily return to yourself, you want the returning advantage. Yes, it could get tangled or something, but someone could catch Cap's shield, too, if they're particularly skilled. This is sort of the tradeoff of choosing a thrown weapon vs a projectile weapon, like a gun or bow and arrow. (Aah, the thrown weapon expert: the only opponent who deliberately disarms himself.) Only the old rule that you can't break the cost down to less than half. So, let's say you buy a Mastery of Elements (AN+1CL) and you choose an AN of 5 and buy +2 CL worth of options. That's a total of CL 8. You can't take more than 4 cost levels of disadvantages. Well, more accurately, you can't benefit from more than that. You can cripple the Action if you want, but it will still cost at least CL 4. Hope that was helpful! If you have more Qs, fire away! ~TWF
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Post by l3eta-00a1x on Aug 6, 2010 9:57:18 GMT -5
I'm just wondering! There could be reasons for this, and it's nice to know. I was just throwing out anything that would give a similar effect, screw add-ons. And I just used 5 as it was an easy number. Yeah, I was mostly wondering about the fact that it would be two different damage types. Because than my laser sword (or whatever) is a lot less useful against Bishop (or whoever). Gotcha! I think the only real reason for the thrown on a chain is that you could get the enemy shooting at you, without losing it permanently. It would also make it easier to find if it got away from you! I though as much. Now I can't go for the really low growth that's (relatively) cheap. You used to be able to get two strength and one extra durability for one measly stone. Alas, change is upon us.
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Post by takewithfood on Aug 6, 2010 10:08:56 GMT -5
Beta, you can still buy Growth 1 and toss in Can't Improve By Lines. That's the same as the old Growth. Costs 1 white.
~TWF
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Post by l3eta-00a1x on Aug 6, 2010 10:15:13 GMT -5
Ah! I thought you meant the AN you actually bought, before additional CL. I see now...
I am apparently very bad at math...
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Post by l3eta-00a1x on Aug 6, 2010 13:54:01 GMT -5
I'm currently messing around trying to create a Hulk with 20+10 stones...
Anyway, I'm wondering about the Efficient Advantage. It says that it wont let you surpass your AN, but does that mean that you couldn't put 6 stones in a Strength Bonus and than get 3 free stones from efficient towards the AN? In my case I have a low Close Combat, but Hulk level Strength (okay, a little lower, only 12+ not 18) so would it be pointless to get Efficient?
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Post by takewithfood on Aug 6, 2010 14:44:28 GMT -5
Let's say you have Strength 5 and Close Combat 4. You can put a total of 9 stones in your box.
If you have the Efficient advantage, you can spend 6 stones and get 3 for free, which totals 9 stones. However, you can't put in 9 and get 12: you're still limited to a maximum of 9 stones.
~TWF
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Post by l3eta-00a1x on Aug 6, 2010 15:15:20 GMT -5
Okay, I didn't know whether the ability bonus counted.
I have actually finished my 20+10 Hulk-ish character, and he can put in 20 stones for a ~25 stone attack, if he has a panel or two to get to that place (Power-Up!).
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Post by takewithfood on Aug 6, 2010 15:16:45 GMT -5
That doesn't actually sound like a good thing, just so you know. U_U'
Can you send or post the CAD? And if you post it, can you please put it in the Character Workshop, not in here?
~TWF
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Post by l3eta-00a1x on Aug 6, 2010 16:45:44 GMT -5
He doesn't have to use it, and he probably wouldn't, but it's just fun to think about (Mini-Hulk SMASH!). And the character was mostly just to see if I could understand the rules (enough to make a character who works), so I'll send 'em in, but he IS a prototype randomness attack.
EDIT: In case it's not clear, I don't think I would ever actually play as him, unless I'm missing something I added to him that makes him more diverse. For now he's essentially the "Hit thing hard" type of person. Spicing him up a bit might work, but as is he's pretty poorly conceived.
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Post by Dionon on Aug 9, 2010 13:28:20 GMT -5
Inventing Complaint: I realized as I was building my test CAD that Inventing isn't worth taking at ranks 1 or 2... This is because you reduced the AN of inventions to the AN of your Inventing. Honestly I'd like to see this back to Inventing AN + Int AN/2 , or Wealth MN + Int AN/2 if that's what you're using, Or even if you're using all three, have it be Inv AN + Int AN + Wea AN / 3 So for me it would be 7 + 3 + 6 = 16 / 3 = 5.2 or 5 in this case... That way people don't have to spend 20 stones to have a respectable Inventing if they buy it at AN 1 (for me it would be 7 + 1 + 6 = 14/3 = 4.67 or 4 in this case)
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Post by takewithfood on Aug 9, 2010 15:56:07 GMT -5
But they shouldn't have a respectable Inventing if they buy it at AN 1. AN 1 = you are as new at this as possible.
Being really smart helps, and having tons of money for resources helps, but ultimately what makes an inventor is the inventy part. That's what the AN is for.
Without a limit, it becomes stupid for really smart and/or wealthy characters not to buy Inventing 1. I'm tired of people making characters with Int 9000+ and AN 1 in everything that comes with a free int bonus. It is boring, and not nearly as clever as people think it is. ^__^
Besides, even with a low AN you can make some pretty awesome shizzle. Remember, it's just limiting ANs and MNs, not total cost levels. You can load all sorts of crazy options onto something and still have it be AN 3 or 2 or whatever. And it will still be useful, if you're creative.
You think the bad guys are holding hostages in this building, but you don't know for sure? Good thing you brought your x-ray goggles (Enhanced Vision 3: x-ray vision = 1 white).
The last hostage is locked up in the bank safe with a time bomb? Good thing you brought your white phosphorous mini-blowtorch (MN 1 Material Class 3 weapon = 6 white).
Oh no, the room is filling with deadly gas! Good thing I brought my micro-scrubbing gas mask (self-contained life form: doesn't breathe = 1 white).
You get the idea. There are all sorts of things you can come up with that don't require a huge AN. If you know what you're up against, you can usually find a weakness to exploit, which makes your attacks/actions/whatever especially efficient.
~TWF
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Post by Dionon on Aug 9, 2010 16:24:38 GMT -5
Okay, Apparantly I misunderstood the action, because my understanding of it was that you had 1 CL to play with per AN, Ok, that entire rant was my bad honestly, I misunderstood your rules.
How would one build a vehicle in this inventing system? Like a motorbike or a [insert name here]mobile. How do you get a vehicle period if it's custom.....
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Post by takewithfood on Aug 9, 2010 17:44:05 GMT -5
If it's bought with Wealth (which I'm guessing it is in your case) then we can just ramp up some of the existing stats for vehicles and call it top-of-the-line. If you want something truly special (it travels through time or shoots lasers, etc), we'll have to come up with something.
EDIT: Your "utility belt" option doesn't have to always literally be a utility belt - I'll also let you put inventions on your vehicles. Batman does this all the time, sorta like "Wow, it would be really convenient if I had a thing on my bike that makes it go up walls. Which reminds me - totally unrelated - I hae this thing on my bike that makes it go up walls. Yep, been there the whole time. *cough*".
~TWF
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